Approach for the club

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16 Nov 2019 16:58 #51 by Alan
Replied by Alan on topic Approach for the club

nobbyblue wrote: Don't be so hard on yourself Alan. You're harmless enough.


Hope you get a fare jumper and a flat on your next shift.
:P
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16 Nov 2019 17:42 #52 by Laffy
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There is nothing to ‘investment broke’ Richard-the solution is to politely ask the entire board to get out of the way.That means both boards and current trust representatives-guilty by association

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16 Nov 2019 17:48 - 16 Nov 2019 17:49 #53 by Bruntonpasty
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A question Laffy, If I read it right, the club now owes nothing to the directors as their debts have been replaced by shares. Does this mean that anyone wanting to take over will need to purchase these shareholdings, if they have any value? do they have any value?

They don't like it up 'em!
Last edit: 16 Nov 2019 17:49 by Bruntonpasty.

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16 Nov 2019 17:58 #54 by Laffy
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In my opinion and no doubt Piglet will correct me, the equity is worth nothing.

I also believe the club is still substantially in debt.Of course, we won’t be told how much because we are only fans.Nobody will take this on until every last cent of stakeholder and EWM debt is written off.

The equity holders can bleat on but they are entirely at the whim of PD.

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16 Nov 2019 18:11 #55 by Mullen103
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Laffy wrote: There is nothing to ‘investment broke’ Richard-the solution is to politely ask the entire board to get out of the way.That means both boards and current trust representatives-guilty by association


I did think the term investment broker was odd - agree no one will invest currently it needs a complete clear out and fresh/start again approach.

I’m hoping Day, plays ball, but I’m not confident on that part. I think he’d rather have the current lot in charge, he knows where he stands with them.

Interesting times ahead - Without any “investment” in January this team will finish the season bottom. We can’t count on Macclesfield as looks like a sale will go through.

At least we’re not Stockport

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16 Nov 2019 18:14 #56 by Laffy
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Having just listened to how Barrow have approached things-and the manager on a long contract, we look like amateurs-run by losers
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16 Nov 2019 18:22 #57 by Mullen103
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Laffy wrote: Having just listened to how Barrow have approached things-and the manager on a long contract, we look like amateurs-run by losers


We’ve known that for years.

This club is in serious danger of dropping out the league - I know some say we’re safe but I’m not confident at all. It’s due to the amateur way the club has been ran truly appalling and embarrassing and I include EWM and the trust.

Please, please go - there’s people wanting to help/takeover and make the club what it is. Not some jolly old boys club where for AJ and SP being involved holds status. JN not bothered as long as his director of some club.

At least we’re not Stockport

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16 Nov 2019 18:36 #58 by Laffy
Replied by Laffy on topic Approach for the club
For a good example of how debt can destroy shareholder value,have a look at Eddie Stobart.

An eye watering £200m of debt in a loss making business-the equity was ‘worth’ £300m plus a short while ago.Its now worth next to nothing and in need of radical surgery.

You are right Richard-the club is in an ever accelerating decline and apathy is setting in.It wouldn’t take too much to arrest this but it starts at the top with the complete removal of a misaligned Board of directors comprising several different agendas-all beholding to EWM.
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16 Nov 2019 18:47 #59 by Kessler
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Mullen103 wrote: This club is in serious danger of dropping out the league - I know some say we’re safe but I’m not confident at all. It’s due to the amateur way the club has been ran truly appalling and embarrassing and I include EWM and the trust.


This approach could be the light at the end of the tunnel. The clubkillers behaviour over the years has been shocking and disgraceful. They need to go.

Mullen103 wrote: Please, please go - there’s people wanting to help/takeover and make the club what it is. Not some jolly old boys club where for AJ and SP being involved holds status. JN not bothered as long as his director of some club.


I always laugh when I see the club asking for volunteers to help with stuff. You can't treat fans like an inconvenience one minute and demand they help you out the next. Treat your fans with respect, don't take criticism personally, actually engage with fans, and there will be plenty of them who are willing to help.
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16 Nov 2019 19:54 #60 by twinkletoes
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Here Lummy, your current employers wouldn't be amongst those businessmen throwing their hats into the ring would they?
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16 Nov 2019 21:05 - 16 Nov 2019 21:06 #61 by lummy8
Replied by lummy8 on topic Approach for the club
Ha ha no Shaun is not involved, he is enjoying his chill out time away from work with his family.

I would try and tap him for sponsorship money though on the commercial side!

As I said on radio today, we are waiting on PD getting back to us which should be next week, ideal situation is that he likes our plans and wants to work alongside us.

Many things to discuss but obviously things need to happen with the debt/shares before we get anywhere.

It could all be dead this time next week or maybe even another consortium come in.

Just trying to help.
Last edit: 16 Nov 2019 21:06 by lummy8.
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16 Nov 2019 21:13 #62 by munchymagic
Replied by munchymagic on topic Approach for the club
All the best with the plans Lummy.

Nice for us United followers to potentially have something to cheer about over the festive period.

Even if nothing comes of it, it is nice that the news is out there rather than the usual silence from the board and their love of secrecy.
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16 Nov 2019 21:39 #63 by carwash
Replied by carwash on topic Approach for the club
Good luck Lummy with your plans!! I'd be surprised if EWM would write off any of the debt but no harm in asking.

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16 Nov 2019 21:59 #64 by Laffy
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Don’t give them the list of your consortium Chris!!

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16 Nov 2019 22:03 #65 by shaldon1
Replied by shaldon1 on topic Approach for the club
I think the answer may be in Dubai and I hope it is.This is the place I believe where PD spends most of his life and I suspect he has financial contacts there.Who knows Dubai are already involved in English football and the next world coup is scheduled to be played there.Perhaps a substantial investment in Carlisle United may be a very old idea from a Dubai point of view.

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16 Nov 2019 22:07 #66 by Laffy
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Not another billionaire!They’re like buses in Cumbria

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16 Nov 2019 22:36 #67 by CCU
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Win or Lose, Up The Blues!

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16 Nov 2019 22:43 #68 by Mullen103
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CCU wrote:


Maybe because there are currently irrelevant and EWM/Day is the 1st person to speak to, I’m just speculating of course.

At least we’re not Stockport

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16 Nov 2019 22:46 #69 by Kessler
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lummy8 wrote: Ha ha no Shaun is not involved, he is enjoying his chill out time away from work with his family.

I would try and tap him for sponsorship money though on the commercial side!

As I said on radio today, we are waiting on PD getting back to us which should be next week, ideal situation is that he likes our plans and wants to work alongside us.

Many things to discuss but obviously things need to happen with the debt/shares before we get anywhere.

It could all be dead this time next week or maybe even another consortium come in.

Just trying to help.


Good luck, I'd really like to see this happen.

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16 Nov 2019 23:27 #70 by paddockspark
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Lummy one slight problem. If you are successful where will you sit? In the directors box or keep your commentators seat ?

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17 Nov 2019 00:12 - 17 Nov 2019 01:27 #71 by PaddockRanger
Replied by PaddockRanger on topic Approach for the club

lummy8 wrote: Ha ha no Shaun is not involved, he is enjoying his chill out time away from work with his family.

I would try and tap him for sponsorship money though on the commercial side!

As I said on radio today, we are waiting on PD getting back to us which should be next week, ideal situation is that he likes our plans and wants to work alongside us.

Many things to discuss but obviously things need to happen with the debt/shares before we get anywhere.

It could all be dead this time next week or maybe even another consortium come in.

Just trying to help.



aye, now the club are in debt to EWM, I too hope for a conclusion to your proposal Lummy. expect the worse and you wont be disappointed, as the saying goes. I feel the current situation is to late to prevent a relegation fight.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2019 01:27 by CCU.

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17 Nov 2019 08:14 #72 by CarlisleWhite
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Lummy - could I ask a question about what you have said on the PD bit, as it confuses me (easy done).
You say you want to work alongside PD, but the club owes him a couple of million, so what would be his role if he stays? Presume he will still have the debt, so how would he fit into the new ownership structure.
Also, how would those in the consortium fit into the ownership structure if that is the case with PD?
If this is not the case, I presume PD will want paid back.
I am assuming that the current owners walk away and their shares are handed over as they are worthless.

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17 Nov 2019 08:26 #73 by BlueAl
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If the custodians really have the clubs best interests at heart, they will publicly welcome a takeover and step aside. The club under their ownership can only be described as disastrous. However I feel this approach will go nowhere and it will be down to the custodians. Best of luck Lummy, anyone who loves the club are fully behind you.

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17 Nov 2019 08:53 #74 by carwash
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The biggest problem facing any proposal is the matter of the personal guarantees given by the 3 custodians. While they are on the hook for £2 million they are not going to want to leave the club. Any incoming investor won't want to take over the guarantees on the debt.

Hopefully EWM can give some guidance on how they think this deadlock can be resolved for the benefit of all parties and allow for succession.

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17 Nov 2019 09:05 #75 by Laffy
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It’s simple-the loans have to be either written off by EWM or paid off by the three.Any other route and I’m afraid it’s one frying pan to another.

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17 Nov 2019 09:11 #76 by bluestblue
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Laffy wrote: It’s simple-the loans have to be either written off by EWM or paid off by the three.Any other route and I’m afraid it’s one frying pan to another.



Perhaps this approach may be the catalyst for EWM finally to explain their position?

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17 Nov 2019 09:12 - 17 Nov 2019 09:29 #77 by nobbyblue
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It'll be interesting to see what kind of businessmen are involved.

One or two that have been mentioned in the past couldn't run a bath!

What would the likes of Steven Skinner bring to the table?

Fred Story had his critics but at least he knew how to run a business if nowt else!
Last edit: 17 Nov 2019 09:29 by nobbyblue.

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17 Nov 2019 09:37 #78 by Dazwacky
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Good luck Lummy hope it goes well the fact that you are talking to PD is progress and the FACTS are that if the 3 amigos leave the missing thousands will return! Hopefully PD will call his debt in and they are forced out, if Lummys consortium can show a new vision and way forward to make the match day experience better on and off the pitch the club could and should move up the leagues with hopefully PD in agreement, fingers crossed for this week

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17 Nov 2019 09:43 #79 by nobbyblue
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Apparently a billionaire from Gretna has come forward so we'll have wait to see what he says before any other takeover can be considered.
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17 Nov 2019 09:45 #80 by carwash
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Laffy wrote: It’s simple-the loans have to be either written off by EWM or paid off by the three.Any other route and I’m afraid it’s one frying pan to another.


But for either EWM or the custodians that would be the worst possible outcome with zero benefit to them. Any deal must have to involve some compromise - even to the extent of a new investor chipping some cash in to get a deal over the line. EWM's response to Lummy's proposal hopefully can shed some light on their thinking over succession.

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17 Nov 2019 09:55 - 17 Nov 2019 10:05 #81 by nobbyblue
Replied by nobbyblue on topic Approach for the club
EWM have a lot to answer for really.

We'd have probably been far better going into administration a while back. We would now be coming out the other side with new owners and a bright future (hopefully!).

Jenks allegiance with Day is just propping up a failed regime with no plans for the future.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2019 10:05 by nobbyblue.

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17 Nov 2019 10:02 #82 by BlueAl
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Agreed. So are EWM being based in Carlisle, keen to help their local football club or is it a freemasonry thing? Brothers helping brothers and not really to fussed that the club is in the gutter.

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17 Nov 2019 10:22 #83 by lummy8
Replied by lummy8 on topic Approach for the club
Exactly, no one is going to take it on in its current state, compromise is essential.

I would love to tell you the businessmen, but I understand their reasons, but believe me I would not put my name to this if they were not very successful but also, didn’t have the club at heart.
We have a long list of businesses looking to get back involved with sponsorship which has blew me away.

Steven Skinner has been key to bringing some big names to the table.
Again, I trust him.

We have not thought about roles, we just want to help, this could happen and then I walk away and carry on with my life now.

If it doesn’t happen, we tried.
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17 Nov 2019 10:37 #84 by chorleybluehoss
Replied by chorleybluehoss on topic Approach for the club
Seeing this news yesterday finally gave us some hope and optimism after a desperate couple of years. I think we need to trust Lummy, when he discusses the current situation he always comes across as someone who both cares about the club but also someone with vision for how to get the club back on track - which is much more than the current regime. Not saying it will be easy as I am sure there are hurdles to be negotiated.

Is there anything we can do as supporters? Surely now is the time to reiterate to the current regime the strength of feeling against them. This doesn't need to be a boycott as I don't believe this is going to have an impact. This needs to be a concerted effort to make sure they know they are not welcome at the club. It needs to be vocal and it needs to be visible. For those who do not wish to go to home games then we have the Morecambe game coming up which is reasonably close and to which we always take a good following. Making the current regime feel uncomfortable in their positions will surely only increase their willingness to move on? It won't solve the EWM question but would Jenkins et al really want to turn down an opportunity to take an escape route if they see the level of disquiet and disrespect towards them?
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17 Nov 2019 10:46 #85 by lummy8
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I get the frustration but initial talks have been positive, I may be wrong but I do get a sense of this may be the right time for them.

We want to do this respectfully and right, be open and honest we possibly can be and try and take this forward.

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17 Nov 2019 10:50 #86 by Sillothblue
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So who will appoint the new manager? The current Board of Directors or the new Board of Directors?

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17 Nov 2019 10:55 #87 by aberdeenblue28
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How about a Lummy in banner

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17 Nov 2019 11:02 #88 by kells
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IN LUMMY WE TRUST

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17 Nov 2019 11:17 #89 by crunchblue
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Wish you all the luck in the world lummy. Hope it works out.

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17 Nov 2019 11:30 #90 by Armo
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There maybe some incentive for EMW - they're not stupid, they can see the downward spiral the club is in.

The current path will only see their debt increase with an inevitable consequence. Sadly, a point will come sooner rather than later that their main guarantor will not be around. The remaining two will not be in a position to cover the debt and EWM will be forced into action. I can't see any option being desirable for them.

With all that, a local takeover with rejuvenated local interest and the possibility of a club breaking even might be really appealing. Lummy's enthusiasm as the public face of the club would be a huge benefit - whilst i enjoy him on the radio, the club could use him more than Radio Cumbria.

It all depends on what Lummy's guys are asking - wiping out all the debt is a big [censored] ask.

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17 Nov 2019 11:34 #91 by Yorkie Blue
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If Lummy pulls this off he should never have to buy his own drink in Carlisle again, and whether he and his consortium are successful or not at least someone with some influence will have had a go at taking the club on and moving it forward. Good luck and best wishes.


Fish and chips and mushy peas are all my brain and body needs

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17 Nov 2019 11:34 #92 by BlueAl
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If a company writes off debt, can they not claim tax relief against it to their benefit, or something like that?

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17 Nov 2019 11:49 #93 by Laffy
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Taking the club over with debt would be insane-the lenders will get a tax deduction for the write off and off the hook.

Good luck Chris

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17 Nov 2019 14:54 #94 by franksidebottom
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chorleybluehoss wrote: Seeing this news yesterday finally gave us some hope and optimism after a desperate couple of years. I think we need to trust Lummy, when he discusses the current situation he always comes across as someone who both cares about the club but also someone with vision for how to get the club back on track - which is much more than the current regime. Not saying it will be easy as I am sure there are hurdles to be negotiated.

Is there anything we can do as supporters? Surely now is the time to reiterate to the current regime the strength of feeling against them. This doesn't need to be a boycott as I don't believe this is going to have an impact. This needs to be a concerted effort to make sure they know they are not welcome at the club. It needs to be vocal and it needs to be visible. For those who do not wish to go to home games then we have the Morecambe game coming up which is reasonably close and to which we always take a good following. Making the current regime feel uncomfortable in their positions will surely only increase their willingness to move on? It won't solve the EWM question but would Jenkins et al really want to turn down an opportunity to take an escape route if they see the level of disquiet and disrespect towards them?


Totally agree, now is the time for the fans and the trust to step up and crank up the pressure on the current board. For too long now the BoD have always had the excuse that there’s not been any plausible approaches when asked the question about selling the club, now we know for a fact there is an interested party, a local genuine interested party therefore there’s no excuse for hanging on.

The trust need to finally stand up and be counted, this is their big opportunity to force change and do what they were set up to do - speak up for the fans. Even more so that it appears they’ve been kept totally in the dark by their fellow board members about the potential takeover, so much for being better off “in the tent”, they’ve been played like a fiddle by Nixon and Co.

The fans can really crank up the pressure on the directors box on Saturday and as already mentioned with a rowdy and vociferous following at Morecambe in a few weeks time. This is a big chance for us all to force change.

“Yeah, I know of Barry. Bit of a fantasist” - John Courtenay 2003

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17 Nov 2019 14:57 #95 by pacirv
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I really hope Day responds as he's noted for not saying anything as we all know.
If he truly cares about the club or his reputation in the city he should talk to the people involved, he holds all the strings and could put the three amigos in a position where they can't do anything but accept the offer as he can call in his debt and drop then right in it.
Plus now is public knowledge they can hardly claim that there is no offers on the table as they appear to be trying again with their silence. Come on Philip do the right thing by the city and the club's fans help us save our club.

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17 Nov 2019 15:08 #96 by franksidebottom
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lummy8 wrote: Exactly, no one is going to take it on in its current state, compromise is essential.

I would love to tell you the businessmen, but I understand their reasons, but believe me I would not put my name to this if they were not very successful but also, didn’t have the club at heart.
We have a long list of businesses looking to get back involved with sponsorship which has blew me away.

Steven Skinner has been key to bringing some big names to the table.
Again, I trust him.

We have not thought about roles, we just want to help, this could happen and then I walk away and carry on with my life now.

If it doesn’t happen, we tried.


Got to say, best of luck Chris, I’m praying this comes off. Much like when there was talk of Courteney putting an end to Knighton’s tenure 20 years ago, I just hope you can run the club a bit better than he did!

I’ve said all along, the key for me is being local, having the right contacts and getting the whole city involved - businesses, sponsors, fans, even the city council. If you’re successful in engaging all these potential sources of income then there’s no need to be ploughing money in personally, there’s no need for a rich benefactor or to be going cap in hand to a local business who’s intentions are unclear - the club will generate its own finance.

This is exactly what the current board haven’t done, they haven’t worked with anyone, they haven’t engaged local businesses, they haven’t worked with the council (only criticised them in the local press), they haven’t even got a marketing man ffs! They’re that arrogant they thought they were clever enough do it their own way, without help from anyone and the result is the position we find ourselves in today.

“Yeah, I know of Barry. Bit of a fantasist” - John Courtenay 2003
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17 Nov 2019 15:27 #97 by Kessler
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franksidebottom wrote: The trust need to finally stand up and be counted, this is their big opportunity to force change and do what they were set up to do - speak up for the fans.


Yes if CUOSC really are a voice for the fans then they should put out a statement very clearly stating they have no faith in the current regime and it's time for them to go.
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17 Nov 2019 15:33 #98 by Mullen103
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Kessler wrote:

franksidebottom wrote: The trust need to finally stand up and be counted, this is their big opportunity to force change and do what they were set up to do - speak up for the fans.


Yes if CUOSC really are a voice for the fans then they should put out a statement very clearly stating they have no faith in the current regime and it's time for them to go.


They released a statement saying they didn’t know anything about an approach - which is probably correct

But they could of said they support it - reading between the lines I don’t think they do - just speculating.

At least we’re not Stockport

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17 Nov 2019 15:37 - 17 Nov 2019 15:42 #99 by nobbyblue
Replied by nobbyblue on topic Approach for the club
The thought that thousands of people will be flocking back just because we get new owners is a bit of a fallacy.

Only if they can move the club forward and things improve on the pitch will the fans turn up.

The vast majority of the fans don't care who the owners are.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2019 15:42 by nobbyblue.

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17 Nov 2019 16:17 - 17 Nov 2019 16:18 #100 by mattcufc
Replied by mattcufc on topic Approach for the club
Was thinking this myself watching sky sports news last night noticed Blackpool had 7500 there yesterday an increase of 4200 on the game v same opponents Last season.
But already quite a drop from the 10,000 crowds they got at the start of the season. All of which coming off having lost a higher fan base than we have.

Don’t get me wrong there are plenty staying away who will return I just don’t think it will be the thousands people think it will be. There is so many other things to do now that don’t cost as much as football does.

Wish you luck with it Lummy and great to see you involved, don’t hide away from it or take a back seat the club needs a figure head who fans can relate too just as much as it does the money men.
Last edit: 17 Nov 2019 16:18 by mattcufc.
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