TOPIC: SquarePass Thread

Has this been deleted?

Hopefully, and quite rightly so.

How do you stop the stream of emails now they have kicked off again ?

I asked for it to be deleted as I received an email saying "The Square Pass Team" had been in with their Solicitors for 3 days and wanted to push for "slander and deformation" (their spelling not mine) against me. I was also told this would be dropped if I put a post on here apologising to Christian Harding and Square Pass - I refused to do that on the basis that what I said was correct. The last I heard from them was last week when I received an email asking for my address, I called a phone number I found on a business details page on the Internet, first I was told I was not speaking to Christian Harding and had the wrong number but then he said it was him, I asked various questions until I was hung up on. There was some pretty serious stuff in the emails but I have doubts over it being true in all honesty, none were signed personally but simply with "The Square Pass Team".

I have let it go now but feel shafted that my friend and my accounts were deleted without explanation, no refund has been given for these either. Complained to PayPal as they processed all the payments but they said the buyer guarantee don't cover these type of games.

I wish there was some kind of adjudication service for this as I have no doubt they would settle in our favour without hesitation.

Probably best left now anyway, I would contact them via the message facility on the site to remove emails or with any questions - anything that is of a negative nature is deleted from social media pages by whoever runs them.

As we said last week Wazza, any solicitor who thinks he has a case to hit you with "deformation" needs to be seriously looked at, we also discussed the slander thing which I think proved he'd never been anywhere near a solicitor, if you're reading Christian the word your solicitor was looking for is libel.

The lad obviously has a real problem and most probably needs to see a doctor rather than a solicitor.

Alan wrote:
These types of emails should usually have an unsubscribe option at the bottom. I'd just hit reply and ask them to take you off their mailing list. You could login to your account and change your email address - that may have the same impact.

Like I say some of the stuff in the emails was pretty heavy, last week Harding was saying he was no longer involved but this week has been sharing the Square Pass promo articles on social media - seems to be involved again once more to me.

Just a shame they couldn't stick to their own rules.

One thing I did wonder about this was when you sign up should you not have to give your name, address and date of birth? People under 18 could be playing this like but I am not sure if you can have a PayPal account if you are under 18 or not - given they process all payments that would probably cover the game for net letting minors play.

When I spoke to PayPal the woman started on about "Fifa credits", anyone know what they are?!

My boy flays fifa, i think the credits are using real money to buy fifa points, you can use the points to buy packs with players in to build a team to play other nerds online! biggest rip off going, EA sports should be ashamed of themselves, kids using all their birthday money etc!!

Mr harding sounds like a proper tool, apologise to him?? CHEEKY GET!

Stinkyturner wrote:
I knew all this "social gaming" was taking off like, thought it was more adults playing each other on League of Legends etc... than kids doing that. What a world.

These are the updated rules for square pass, anyone playing should read them - basically says they can shut down any account without reason:

Not sure what "slader" is mind, spelling is awful in places

.........................................................

Square Pass can and will run promotional events throughout the season with either free virtual credits or sweepstake teams given out without the need to notify users.

No personel involved in the running of Square Pass is allowed to participate in any of our games (The predictor & Sweepstake).

Square Pass is not responsible for any changes that may be made.

All fans that signs up and or donates to their club via Square Pass needs to be 18 years old or over. Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence or suspected evidence of the user being under the age of 18.

Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence or suspected evidence of multiple accounts, teaming up, defamation, slader or other evidence of attempts to tarnish Square Pass's reputation (either involving exaggeration, misleading half-truths, ad hominem argument, or manipulation of facts to present an untrue picture of Square Pass).

Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence of the user being involved directly or indirectly with any form of violence in Football. Please refer to the UK (Offences and Disorder) Act 1999.

When you have clicked 'Donate Now', 'Checkout' or 'Checkout and Pay' when either purchacing virtual credits or a Sweepstake team you have agreed that you have read the latest rules of the Predictor and Sweepstake Games as well as Square Pass's terms and conditions.

If your Square Pass account is deleted (with or without notice) you will not recieve any refunds for any money paid to play our games (The Predictor and Sweepstake) or monies donated to your club.

Square Pass shall not be responsible for any losses arising out of the unauthorized use of your account.

Square Pass can cancel the game or any part of it at any stage in the event of circumstances beyond Square Pass's reasonable control.

Square Pass reserves the right to terminate this Agreement, your account, your use of the games and suspend, terminate and/or delete your account without any notice.

................................................................................................

Wazza wrote: They spelt deformation wrong.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

He could have saved writing all that and just put something like:

Square Pass can do whatever we want.

The argumentum ad hominem part is interesting (it means to rubbish an argument by making an attack on the arguer), and what the fuck is suspected evidence?

There are more errors as well Loser, mainly grammar and sentence construction, for example:

"All fans that signs up and or donates to their club via Square Pass needs to be 18 years old or over."

"Square Pass can and will run promotional events throughout the season with either free virtual credits or sweepstake teams given out without the need to notify users."

"Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence of the user being involved directly or indirectly with any form of violence in Football."

I have no idea (well, to be fair I have) who is responsible for writing those terms and conditions, but their command of the English language is an utter disgrace, so it is obviously not anybody with any sort of legal training. I would suggest that quite a number of those terms and conditions could be quite easily challenged, if anybody ever needed to do so.

The stuff he writes when there are problems is funny like.

Our technical department, our payments department, our customer queries department etc... reminds me of Only Fools and Horses when Del Boy had the Ski gear and Rodders is in it all down the market , Del Boys phone goes in front of a load of customers and he answers it with "Trotters Independent Traders, Arctic Clothing Department."

Christian needs a legal department, and a writing department.

Least everyone knows where they stand now, been an experience.

I suppose mate, perhaps doesn't make up for the losses you and your mate have suffered, but at least you've been able to warn everyone else about their shambolic practices.

I made over 1k myself, been a strange way that he has dealt with this as some weeks I was buying over 50 quids worth of credits (meaning I was donating over 20 quid a week to the Clubs). Prize money never changed according to how many played, stopping the highest staking players is pretty stupid to me when you are complaining that the incomings are falling way short of the outgoings. Mate has been shafted a few times on more stuff related to a man's word than anything (over 400 quid in May), just seems to think he can do whatever he wants - those "rules" highlight this without question to me.

Good job he never managed to buy CUFC like he reckons he tried to, if this is out to go by the repercussions could have been devastating.

Wazza wrote: l

I played when I was 17, I won £100 one week but couldn't have a PayPal account because I needed to be 18. I emailed Christian to see if this was a problem, and he said no and did the payment via bank transfer.

JackCUFC wrote:
Ahh right wonder why he added this rule:

All fans that signs up and or donates to their club via Square Pass needs to be 18 years old or over. Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence or suspected evidence of the user being under the age of 18.

"Your Square Pass account will be deleted without notice if evidence or suspected evidence of the user being under the age of 18."

Just when it suits him obviously.

The bloke is basically a Grade A f*cking pillock from the various stuff I've heard this week!!!

Does anyone know if it is legal to have rules like that?

Reads to me that they can pretty much withhold any money paid by a customer without a reason in all honesty.

Wazza, that's one of the reasons I think most of those terms and conditions could easily be challenged.

When you set something like that up, the terms and conditions should, without any doubt, be written by somebody with a legal background. Adding to them as you go along does not seem a very sensible thing to do either. This has been proven to be a hell of a mess over the past few weeks, and some of the stuff I now know is absolutely appalling. The chap "running" it has, it would seem, no business management skills, nor any customer relations skills. It might have been a good idea, and to me it seems as if it was, but he had definitely not looked into the possible pitfalls. It would appear that he never took any proper professional advice, and some of the stuff he has posted on here about his customers would have made Pattison cringe.

If he wants it to be a success he needs to get some real advice about how to run a business, the legal problems involved and completely rebranding, and he needs to do it quickly. If he doesn't I can see him causing massive problems for himself further down the line. What has gone wrong once could easily happen again, and it isn't just the chance of an abandoned game, there are other problem areas which need to be addressed. Most importantly he will have to change his attitude, his customers (especially the ones who put real cash in) are the lifeblood of his business, they should be treated as such.

He might find he'll have trouble getting anybody who has seen any of this to advise him, I certainly wouldn't.

The emails are really strange, he is clearly sending them to me but talking about himself and singing his own praises in the third person. Talking about being off work with stress, when I rang him he said he was having a beer.

JackCUFC wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, and no fault on Jack, but surely this means they had knowledge of underage gambling and then still paid out in it ?

DeckchairBlue wrote:
Well you would get really done for that in the current climate in the UK and Australia.

Think it would need be classed as gambling, really not sure if it is but they must have added that new rule for a reason. Strange carry on.

You're not wrong.

As somebody who frequently gets involved with T's and C's on tender documents and setting up corporate agreements I would officially describe those quoted above as utter balls. You could drive a bus through the gaps in those T's and C's. Anybody would be able to rip them apart legally if required. To be honest he may as well not have any, for all the good they will do him.

Northumbrian wrote:
Can't say I am surprised. Who do you go about complaining to here then in your opinion? It's only about £250 quid between me and my pal but it is more about the way it has all been dealt with now - I only stumbled across these new rules this morning.

If it was a bookmaker it would be IBAS for the rule argument and the Gambling Commission for the terms and conditions. Not really sure who this is registered with though. I cannot find a land address even on the website.

loser wrote:
Defamation actually is one of the few words that is correctly spelt.

kellsblue wrote:
You need to read the full thread to understand the comment from loser Kells.

Ah well, can't be arsed with that.

Wazza wrote:
If it isn't gambling what is it ?

If I was you I would still report them to the gambling commission and attach a copy of the new rules as well.

bluealf wrote:
Been on the site today having a look, did know a lad who was quite high up there but he moved on. Emailed them asking if they could help and if it was a concern for them, sometimes you don't need a licence but with a cash prize I would have thought you deffo do.

They do have an Australian regulator like:

www.moneysmart.gov.au/

abr.business.gov.au/SearchByAbn.aspx?SearchText=24+162+120+925

The worst thing about this whole fiasco is that Wazza was one of the main people in trying to get others on here to play when it was clearly against his interests as if he was winning and the prize was guaranteed then why would you try to lower your odds. The saddest thing for me is he put his long term relationship with topdog on the line in support of this game .

Dancingbear wrote:
Ha, to be honest I thought more people would give it a go and it would take off - probably naive as well with working on a pc all day I had more opportunity to do work on it, realised now how few people actually only access the internet via smart phones these days and the site must have been pretty poor via a smart phone which in turn put people off.

Knew something like this would eventually happen, have to have solid rules and stick to them in this game - can't make customers pay for your own errors. One thing making goodwill payments but another changing rules as it suits.

I was surprised as well that you didn't need to be 18. I read the terms and conditions and at the time there was no mention of age restrictions, nor did they ask for my DOB when I signed up. Christian wasn't bothered by my age when I declared it when I won one week.

I didn't gamble much over the year, less than £25 I think anyway including two £5 sweepstake teams.

Just seems to live in a bit of a dreamworld, been going for a while now all of this fantasy football/predictor carry on.

This was posted in 2010 on the official CUFC Facebook page by Harding as well:

Fantasyfitba is a online game that I've been running now for a few years, the bank liked the idea and gave me money to develop it onto the world wide web....they think it's going to be huge! Maybe one year I'll sponser Carlisle United or even buy them. I hoping to get 1,000 people next year so a $50,000 prize! SO BECOME A FAN AND I'LL LET YOU KNOW WHEN YOU CAN CHOOSE YOUR TEAMS FOR NEXT SEASON smile emoticon

The bank must have started asking questions a long time ago and the spelling and general english ain't improved a jot.

I remember him on the old board posting something cringey about having a bet with his missus involving a blow job.

I remember that, sure it was the day he announced this game was going to be starting!

Wasn't it him who appeared by donating a few tickets for the match despite living overseas? Folk thought it was a wind-up etc...

thecumbrians.boards.net/thread/323/new-stadium-build

Must have been around the time he attempted to buy the Club that thread and was looking for feedback on his Stadium ideas.

thecumbrians.boards.net/thread/1637/offi...kly-predictor?page=1

Dan, I don't know when I portrayed my self as a businessman? I run Square Pass with another friend as a hobby. I'm not sure what type of business you run but I hope it makes a profit? Square Pass doesn't make a profit in fact the exact opposite. I run a highly successfully Geologist consultant business which as any good business makes a profit, as a hobby I don't care that it runs at a loss, if there for clubs to raise money.

Some bloke.

Did he even have the correct licences

Waterworks wrote:
Not sure on that.

Funny carry on. Like he is living in a Utopia where people would play and not care about the game they were playing and all would be ok because it is raising money for Clubs. It's unreal really - some people have actually "donated" to Premier League Clubs like Manchester United and Everton, what good is that kind of cash going to do for them. Needed to be focused on Clubs who really needed it and in turn customers/fans would maybe have played more, 140 quid been raised for Celtic like yet nothing for a Club like Cowdenbeath.

That is why I got Penrith on the donations list (in August, supposedly after he knocked me back from working with him), I donated nigh on every credit after that to Penrith and the total raised is now £103 (reckon all of that was by me). I actually said when I sorted it out (as I know the lad who does the social media at Penrith) that the cash raised may help Bradley Hodgson get to matches he plays in etc...

Wazza wrote: It sounds like the gambling commission could be a good place to start. You could always contact the CAB who are often more helpful than you might imagine and should be able to point you in the right direction.

Northumbrian wrote:
Cheers.

You see in the first week of September he was on here saying he was pulling the plug and the accountants would be in to sort it out. Where do these donations go? As he says on the site they only pay in £500 blocks unless other arrangements are made. So if they can't afford to keep running it the donations don't seem so safe. You probably need to be a registered charity as well for this given he states it is "non profit". Absolute farce like.

They had clubs like Man Utd on the donation list ? Celtic ? I can't believe they were on.

To be honest I didn't play because it didn't seem like it was ran that well and he often moaned it wasn't working and wondered why. I think it could work well under somebody experienced in similar things.

Waterworks wrote:
All donation totals here:

squarepass.org/clublist-222.html

Scotland are even on it and I am sure you could donate to Bosnia at one point.