What does a train guard / conductor do ?

The problem is these guys are ‘ordinary working me’-they are on big salaries and pensions etc but most importantly they know they have a substantial ship given the nature of the job.

You cannot seriously group this lot with for example cleaners or shop workers on £8.50 an hour-sadly these are the very people who need employment protection, not the well paid key workers with fat pensions.

I watched the Thatcher programme the other night and nearly fell off my seat laughing at the coal union guy who claimed that it ‘wasn’t fair’ that Thatcher had the foresight to stockpile coal before the strike, thus giving her the upper hand -I call that tactic smart.

What a pity the miners weren’t led by the nose by an out of control Marxist with another agenda.

Sorry-not ‘ordinary working men’

Laffy wrote: nearly fell off my seat laughing at the coal union guy who claimed that it ‘wasn’t fair’ that Thatcher had the foresight to stockpile coal before the strike, thus giving her the upper hand -I call that tactic smart.

Both of those are true. If one side arranges things so they have a clear advantage then it isn't fair. However they shouldn't have expected her to play fair, and should have anticipated a tactic like that. The Malvinas War had only been a couple of years earlier, she had firmly established herself as a no nonsense tough politician. There was no excuse for the unions seriously underestimating her, but it's completely true and valid to point out she wasn't being fair.

I think you mean the Falklands.

Laffy wrote: Sorry-not ‘ordinary working men’

Whilst not knowing any tube workers I do know some train drivers, these people tend to get the same bull crap.
They are normal working people that through intelligence, hard work and a slice of luck have found themselves on a nice little earner. Good luck to them.
As for the £8.50 workers needing protection........they don’t they just need paid more than what they get but they don’t have the muscle to get it.
And by the way they will never be treated with fairness and respect by any government, least of all a Tory one.

5x2-9 = one more [censored] i give about londanistan .

I think the answers 1, Happy?

The Woolwich Ferry has also been beset with strikes this year. Just to wind Silentone up. shopstewards.net/2019/05/nssn-439-suppor...in-woolwich-bromley/

Unrepentant blue wrote:

Laffy wrote: Sorry-not ‘ordinary working men’

Whilst not knowing any tube workers I do know some train drivers, these people tend to get the same bull crap.
They are normal working people that through intelligence, hard work and a slice of luck have found themselves on a nice little earner. Good luck to them.
As for the £8.50 workers needing protection........they don’t they just need paid more than what they get but they don’t have the muscle to get it.
And by the way they will never be treated with fairness and respect by any government, least of all a Tory one.

Sadly it is not possible to tell tho whole story without being branded a racist, however they are not selected because they are : "normal working people that through intelligence, hard work and a slice of luck have found themselves on a nice little earner."

I do wish the mods would stop censoring these threads, this has nothing whatsoever to do with guard/conductors

Touching a nerve somewhere.......

carwash wrote: The Woolwich Ferry has also been beset with strikes this year. Just to wind Silentone up. shopstewards.net/2019/05/nssn-439-suppor...in-woolwich-bromley/

Not to mention those fascist bully boy librarians.

Just remember it was those naughty naughty Tories who gave us the right to buy your council house-a first leg up for many working class people.

Laffy wrote: Just remember it was those naughty naughty Tories who gave us the right to buy your council house-a first leg up for many working class people.

Problem with that was successive governments of all descriptions didnt build enough new social housing and programmes like homes under the hammer have made it fashionable for people to try and milk the rental sector.

Gave us the right to buy your council house. Sound of hammer hitting nail head

Laffy wrote: Just remember it was those naughty naughty Tories who gave us the right to buy your council house-a first leg up for many working class people.

Speaking of naughty Tories good to see Gove owning up to his Cocaine taking just before it came out in book.

I’m pleased he’s admitted coke-rules this wet fish out of the running.A modern day Macbeth.

Selling off council houses was a masterstroke-it gave many families a lever to move up the ladder.Bill Clinton had the same idea in Africa-give the locals something tangible to lever.

Problem with the council house sell off was it wasn’t followed up with more stock.

So, a question for the investors and Unions. The Royal Mail Group which has a historical Union influence which has negotiated "the best terms and conditions in the UK delivery industry.”

However, unlike TfL has no monopoly, therefore the competition is tearing them apart on price. This has seen the profits collapse and share price almost half.

With 145,000 workers, this is a big problem, and raises a question over its future.

If you were CEO, what would you do to arrest this serious problem ?

The Royal Mail guarantees to deliver letters to every household in this country. No other firm does.

If you were a really hard nosed CEO you would stop this.

Imagine the outcry.

No future there, as we all go paperless and everything getting done on-line.

Don't think that would help the share value or secure jobs.

The future is on-line sales and parcel delivery (something the PO should have recognised years ago), the PO simply can't compete as the cost base is to high.

In the old days, the Royal Mail had a monopoly and grew lazy and fat.Its now a lot leaner but so is the competition. 99 times out of a hundred, most people would say price is the driver for parcels and letters, which means the underlying cost base is vulnerable and exposed to margin pressure.

It needs to cut the number of services it offers and focus on those where it can compete.Not easy with unionised workers and gold plated pensions.

Unionised workers? You mean less easy to exploit workers.

Well the union can bleat on all it wants but if the business is dying, it needs to get together with the management and figure out a way of building a new future.Striking in the postal market, which is highly competitive, will be a disaster for all.

Many unions are good-but there are some that simply behave like Luddites.You know who they are.

Dancingbear wrote: Unionised workers? You mean less easy to exploit workers.

Of that there is no doubt.

However, the Unions negotiating the current terms and conditions was at a time when the Post Office services had a high demand, in the case of letters, that is decreasing, however, parcel delivery has sky-rocketed.

As they no-longer hold a monopoly (unlike letter delivery), they do not appear to be able to compete with such a huge overhead.

What would you do to protect jobs against what is a likely sell-off of the Post office, leading to mass redundancies ?

Do you think the workforce would accept pay cuts and reduced working hours to save jobs ?

If you were me, would you dump your Post office shares ?

Dunno but its a [censored] having to wait in all day for various parcel delivery firms to turn up. At least the crickets on.

Dancingbear wrote: Dunno but its a [censored] having to wait in all day for various parcel delivery firms to turn up. At least the crickets on.

Cricket indeed, that's you outed then, none of your fellow shop stewards will speak to you at the next arm wrestling convention.....

On a more positive note - was there a steam train around in Carlisle this afternoon as I could hear loads of 'hoots' coming from the stations direction

It’s Glasgow Fair fortnight-the two weeks when Glaswegians, who scrimp and save to take their families on holiday, desert the city

So what do Unite do?They call a rolling strike at Glasgow airport-4 hours every day.This despite getting annual inflation busting salary hikes.

Absolutely pathetic-and I doubt there will be much sympathy in the security queues.

Scrimp and scrape? Do you speak for all those Glaswegian families you jumped up tit.

Lets see from tomorrow the guards on the coastal line start to give out silly penalty fares...surely if they have any sense, discretion will be used otherwise they will become bigger [censored] than traffic wardens .

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Read the package then Melbourne

3pc pa pay rise, one off bonus and 16pc annual contribution to their pension schemes-and still not happy.

If only the social care sector had such pay rises....ive had to stop my pension as i need the money now to use...

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While generally it is a good thing that the average person puts money into a pension, on an individual basis it barely makes any sense. Administration charges and low rates of return on the investments mean that the pension you'd get after decades of sacrifice would probably not be worthwhile. I don't blame anyone for not bothering to save if they need the money now.

markredfox73 wrote: If only the social care sector had such pay rises....ive had to stop my pension as i need the money now to use...

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Sadly Mark that’s what the tories are happy with, a race to the bottom with the plebs arguing over who got the best paltry payrise. Our soon to be prime minister thinks the minimum wage is a tenner. Beggars belief

Its a sad state of affairs... life has become much tougher running a house on your own...7-8 years ago it was fine..What has crippled me most is the change in Child Maintainance..almost doubled since new rules were enforced...council tax has skyrocketted too for single folk..then add other important things to fork out for....im.having less spare money than people on benefits...its not right in this day and age...ive had full austerity cuts to bills to try and help get by for now... Workplace pension i used has gone up to 5% but i wasnt given an option to reduce this at work..so had no choice to cancel...50 quid a month is half a weeks income to me now..so yeh its a case of prioritising at this moment in time.Martin Lewis made this clear on his show you may get a small pay rise but with pension increase..disposable income you would be worse off...he was correct

Wages in social care are very poor compared to other jobs... surely its worth more than someone cleaning tables in spoons for example?

Going back to Child support..well i feel for a lot of folk who have been royallly shafted by the new system which punishes you for working all hours god sends and its sad reading fellas wanting to top themselves due to the system.Depressing

Some folk need to think themselves lucky if on good wages round here...

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Laffy wrote: Read the package then Melbourne

3pc pa pay rise, one off bonus and 16pc annual contribution to their pension schemes-and still not happy.

I suppose you won't be happy with Boris's pledge today to give public sector workers a pay rise.
After all it's tax payers money he'll be spending and with most of it, as you say, coming from the high tax payers

MRF, I had no idea what the child maintenance rates were. I've just checked. On the basic rate, if you’re paying for:
•One child, you’ll pay 12% of your gross weekly income
•Two children, you’ll pay 16% of your gross weekly income
•Three or more children, you’ll pay 19% of your gross weekly income
Someone earning about £17,000 a year would therefore be paying as much again in child maintenance for 1 kid as they would in income tax and NI. They'd only be left with £250 a week to live on for rent, food and bills. Certainly doesn't seem fair.

Mine is now £187 a month..they base it on previous tax years years wages..not current..so in theory you maybe working less hours inc less overtime...but they will only change it if you are earning 25% less.. so you can see where i am coming from.. many workers rely on extra hours.. if they run dry..they earn less but not enough to cover the shortfall of 25% less yet they have to plug that gap in paying...Absolutely nothing is taken into account in regards to bills and living arrangements/personal circumstances..

The old system.was fairer as it was on your basic rate of pay... any overtime was your own money..that privelege is gone.
Its crippled many dads tbh....there are no loops now to help...just doesnt pay to work.


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Dancingbear wrote:

markredfox73 wrote: If only the social care sector had such pay rises....ive had to stop my pension as i need the money now to use...

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Sadly Mark that’s what the tories are happy with, a race to the bottom with the plebs arguing over who got the best paltry payrise. Our soon to be prime minister thinks the minimum wage is a tenner. Beggars belief

So what do suggest DB, let Jezza and his band of merry lunatics control the purse strings ?

There is no such thing as Government money, it is tax-payers money. So unless your buddies in the Unions realise quickly, every-time they demand this that and the other, it can only be paid for by raising more revenue, taking money out of Mr Average Labour voters pocket, and giving it to Mr above Average earning Unionised voters pocket, great idea, eh........

Before you role out the old chestnut of ' Tax the Rich ' . They will simply jump ship, just like they did in the 70's, when the UK went bankrupt.

The only way Jezza's Marxist agenda can work, is if everything is Nationalised, so there is no competition. Well, I'm afraid that will never happen.


Forgot to add, we used to have a bit in reserve in Gold, but your old pal Brown flogged it cheap (at a loss of 5Bn)

To avoid confusion that is £5,000,000,000.

I’m entirely happy with public sector workers getting a fair deal-I personally don’t think 3pc pa rises, a £600 one off bonus and 16pc pa pension contribution is a bad deal for largely unskilled workers-they should look elsewhere but won’t of course because they are on a good number and know they can disrupt a key industry.Most would love it-eg the care sector which is woefully underpaid for the hours and effort these people have to put in.

Next time there is a strike over pensions, they should be shown where it comes from-not a magic money tree, but out of other people’s pockets

thesilentone wrote:

Dancingbear wrote:

markredfox73 wrote: If only the social care sector had such pay rises....ive had to stop my pension as i need the money now to use...

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Sadly Mark that’s what the tories are happy with, a race to the bottom with the plebs arguing over who got the best paltry payrise. Our soon to be prime minister thinks the minimum wage is a tenner. Beggars belief

So what do suggest DB, let Jezza and his band of merry lunatics control the purse strings ?

There is no such thing as Government money, it is tax-payers money. So unless your buddies in the Unions realise quickly, every-time they demand this that and the other, it can only be paid for by raising more revenue, taking money out of Mr Average Labour voters pocket, and giving it to Mr above Average earning Unionised voters pocket, great idea, eh........

Before you role out the old chestnut of ' Tax the Rich ' . They will simply jump ship, just like they did in the 70's, when the UK went bankrupt.

The only way Jezza's Marxist agenda can work, is if everything is Nationalised, so there is no competition. Well, I'm afraid that will never happen.


Forgot to add, we used to have a bit in reserve in Gold, but your old pal Brown flogged it cheap (at a loss of 5Bn)

To avoid confusion that is £5,000,000,000.

We aren’t really talking about unionised high paid workers here though are we. We’re talking the care sector and low paid workers. Personally I’d clamp down on all these 1 person PLCs

If I was an unscrupulous boss I would just offer the £600 one off bonus. The following year I would again just offer a £600 one off bonus and for as many years after as I could get away with.