GENERAL ELECTION 2017 THREAD

All GE stuff in here, save clogging up the Board!

Any new Threads will be moved to here!

Happy arguing folks!

You can't beat an Andrew Neil interview with a piss soaked tramp.

I get one about 4 times a day.

Sorry,misread the title.

tinyurl.com/How-Many-MPs-Now-By-Party

My Estimate After The 8th June General Election :-
Conservative 375
Labour 189
Scottish Nationalist 49
Liberal Democrat 16
Others 21

Ross Balderstone wrote: tinyurl.com/How-Many-MPs-Now-By-Party

My Estimate After The 8th June General Election :-
Conservative 375
Labour 189
Scottish Nationalist 49
Liberal Democrat 16
Others 21

Not a chance 50 tory MP.s will face allegations of serious shit in the run up to the election to fu ck up there chances in fact i.ve been very busy on that front just this afternoon and a couple of them went over the weekend i believe add to that people are going to stand against more of them with opposite Brexit veiws to split their vote.

May could yet live to regret calling ths election.

The only thing that can fu ck this up is if Corbyn is stupid enough to try to deselect the 160 labour MP.s who think hes a wa nker

This is a welcome early election for the Labour Party. With Corbyn as leader it will get absolutely flayed, then select a new leader and begin to become a real force. This is an early chance to get that flaying, rather than in 2020. The Labour Party recovery starts on June 9th, having been absolutely flayed on June 8th.

That's just my opinion. I do not know. Nobody knows. But betting on a decreased Tory majority would seem to be a complete waste of money.

Well i.m not calling it till i see which Labour Partys candidates are standing and i dont really see how anyone else can

Had a look on the Carlisle Labour Party website yesterday, it hasn't been updated for a year by the looks...

Had a look on the Carlisle Labour Party website yesterday, it hasn't been updated for a year by the looks...

Their Twitter had retweeted this today though...

Ross Balderstone wrote: This is a welcome early election for the Labour Party. With Corbyn as leader it will get absolutely flayed, then select a new leader and begin to become a real force. This is an early chance to get that flaying, rather than in 2020. The Labour Party recovery starts on June 9th, having been absolutely flayed on June 8th.

That's just my opinion. I do not know. Nobody knows. But betting on a decreased Tory majority would seem to be a complete waste of money.

So you reckon they might get flayed?

Strange that Ruth Alcroft lives in Aglionby but represents Denton Holme ward?

Talk about a car crash....

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/d...iating-a7712916.html

Out of interest, are folk voting Tory because they support Tory policy, or is it simply a vote against Labour?

In fact, scrap that. Can anybody point me in the direction of the Tory policy platform? I'm struggling to find it...

Nice to see Dianne Abbot doing her bit today ...

Car crash radio ...couldn't happen to better waste of space and tax payers money,

What a joke that woman is..

lovely painting though

Tactical voting for me this time that I am not happy about doing at all.

Although everybody votes on issues that affect them, NHS, crime, economy, local issues never has there been an election where our standing in the world has been so important.

That said, May is the only leader of all the parties that seems to have a shred of statesmanship.

Quite funny watching the fall out from the local election results.... must have been quite a shock for some who thought the Liberals would pick up lots of votes from angry "remain" voters. It has to be remembered that the areas that were predominantly remain in the referendum were in the wealthy south east.... there is no way those people are going to switch to a party that will put income tax up by 1% to fund the NHS... even if they supported remain in the rerendum. They have too much to lose financially.

Must also have been a shock to those Corbynistas ho genuinely thought he was in with a chance on the back of one opinion poll last week. If you can't even run your own party then the public aren't going to trust you to run the country. Diane Abbott will get much of the blame as she has just proved how little thought has gone into the costing of the pie-in-the-sky promises Corbyn has been coming out with.

The Tories must be jumping with joy inside but it is quite funny watching them try to play down the results and try to ensure that people will get out to vote on GE day.. They have, and will benefit, from large numbers of Labour voters tactically voting purely on Brexit. This GE may be the only time some of these hard core Labour supporters ever vote Tory.... really it is Labour's own fault for not being clear on their Brexit position. Junker and his EU pals are playing right into Teresa May's hands... their tough rhetoric in the last couple of weeks was designed to weaken TM's position.... but it has done the exact opposite. It has simply brought the focus back from the NHS and Education and refocused the GE back on Brexit .... and primarily who will be the toughest negotiator with the EU.

Local elections don't always show voting patterns for GE... but you'd expect Labour to be gaining right now on a local level as the opposition party. It's going to take a major Tory balls up or mass complacency from their supporters for this to be anything other than a landslide victory.

Well its Tory for me for the first time in my lifetime, Labour with Clown Corbyn and Diana (I'm shit at maths) Abbott, Ginger turd Farron who doe'nt know the meaning of Democratic, And UKIP who are sliding down the crapper. I'ts a no brainer...

At a loss myself, but definitely not voting Tory. I care to much about the NHS and our education system at the bottom end. Tories build a culture of greed. They feather the nests of the rich and change the rules to suit themselves when they don't get their own way. I've totally lost faith in politics and our voting system. We are heading for a divided and bitter UK which is quite scary.

Socialism is a fine and admirable ideal, it is however, under the current socialist parties, probably unaffordable. It would also appear that the british public don't really want a socialist led country, or, they see the ideal, but don't trust them to fulfill it without bankrupting the country. The LibDems have announced that if they win the election(I know....I know.....) they would increase tax to pay for health and social care. Great idea, but no risk to them as they'll not get in to power to implement it. should labour follow this policy? It would make a change for a main political party to actually be honest enough to say they would increase tax for this ring fenced reason, but then, tax increases don't win votes!

Is this Election purely about Brexit? Hmmmmm..... maybe, maybe not. Some critics say TM has no mandate to lead the country, she will have next month! Would you trust Jeremy and his lot to negotiate our exit from the EU? I wouldn't!!! not for one second would I !!!!! There's much bedwetting being done about "the hard brexit" Time will tell whether TM playing her cards close to her chest is the way forward or not. Jeremy doesn't have a poker face!! I liken the situation to buying a car from a dealership. Jeremy would go in, tell the salesman how much he had to spend and that he will he will definitely buy the car. TM would be somewhat more cagey, tougher talking and get a far better deal than jeremy!

If there was a credible alternative, offering something different, more centrist and pragmatic than the current runners and riders, Id take a serious look at them, however, there ain't and so the Tories will get my vote.

Just a few ponderings.

Hard and Soft Brexit were invented by the agitators.

It's a negotiate or capitulate Brexit, and with Junker on the other side of the table, the gloves are off..........

Junker is just a bitter old drunk.

He doesn't like the British because a) we were one of only two out of the 28 who voted against him becoming President and b) Brexit is a huge embarrassment to happen during his term. He has faced calls from some of the EU countries to stand down as a result.

As such he cant help himself from taking cheap pops at the UK whenever given the chance, but the fool doesn't realise its just hardening the UK's resolve and turning us even more against the EU. He should listen to Tusk and pipe down if he wanted to advance the EU's negotiating hand but he just cant do it.

I see John McDonnell has been on TV this morning pushing the Labour policy of tax increases for those who earn over £80,000. At first this policy was between £70,000-£80,000 but it now seems to have settled on £80k. MP's salary is £74,000. That's convenient for them.

I can't see that raising the sort of money Labour would want to throw about, He knows he won't have a chance to implement it so he can say what he likes. Was talking to two mates of mine yesterday, both would describe themselves as Labour supporters, yet one says he probably won't vote as he couldn't vote Tory and the other says he'll vote tory as there is no other realistic choice.

Kinda hoping for a hung Govt, with the opposition joining forces against the Tories. A future one party Tory dictatorship scares me where they can do anything they want regardless of what voters want.

pacirv wrote: Kinda hoping for a hung Govt, with the opposition joining forces against the Tories. A future one party Tory dictatorship scares me where they can do anything they want regardless of what voters want.

You may not like what the Tories MIGHT do, but I would be just as fearful about the mess the others might create in a coalition, god almighty, that would be a car crash!!

Armageddon more like if that happens. They would spend all day arguing while the country sinks

The first place to start a coalition is inside the Labour Party.

Bruntonpasty wrote: I can't see that raising the sort of money Labour would want to throw about, He knows he won't have a chance to implement it so he can say what he likes. Was talking to two mates of mine yesterday, both would describe themselves as Labour supporters, yet one says he probably won't vote as he couldn't vote Tory and the other says he'll vote tory as there is no other realistic choice.

Well maybe you should explain to them that by looking at the candidates and voting for whoever has the best chance of beating their local Tory Tw at isnt going to elect a Corbyn government or stop Brexit but could well save us all from the 5 years of pain that a 100 seat Tory majority will bring.

Waltero wrote: Armageddon more like if that happens. They would spend all day arguing while the country sinks

Well i hope they argue with them for five years at least that will stop them having carte blanch to destroy the NHS and whats left of the country

Cumbrian Candidates revealed...

www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/latest/Full-l...b62a-69ed72bf8eb9-ds

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Bruntonpasty wrote: I can't see that raising the sort of money Labour would want to throw about, He knows he won't have a chance to implement it so he can say what he likes. Was talking to two mates of mine yesterday, both would describe themselves as Labour supporters, yet one says he probably won't vote as he couldn't vote Tory and the other says he'll vote tory as there is no other realistic choice.

Well maybe you should explain to them that by looking at the candidates and voting for whoever has the best chance of beating their local Tory Tw at isnt going to elect a Corbyn government or stop Brexit but could well save us all from the 5 years of pain that a 100 seat Tory majority will bring.

I wouldn't be so condescending as to suggest to these two well educated, former civil servants that they don't understand what they are doing when they very clearly do. I would pose you a question NS. You, as pro brexiteer, would you be confident that a Corbyn lead government would give the country a brexit it voted for? For example, their leaked manifesto says nothing about slowing or halting immigration? a subject close to your heart, yet you would advocate we should vote Labour?

Bruntonpasty wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Bruntonpasty wrote: I can't see that raising the sort of money Labour would want to throw about, He knows he won't have a chance to implement it so he can say what he likes. Was talking to two mates of mine yesterday, both would describe themselves as Labour supporters, yet one says he probably won't vote as he couldn't vote Tory and the other says he'll vote tory as there is no other realistic choice.

Well maybe you should explain to them that by looking at the candidates and voting for whoever has the best chance of beating their local Tory Tw at isnt going to elect a Corbyn government or stop Brexit but could well save us all from the 5 years of pain that a 100 seat Tory majority will bring.

I wouldn't be so condescending as to suggest to these two well educated, former civil servants that they don't understand what they are doing when they very clearly do. I would pose you a question NS. You, as pro brexiteer, would you be confident that a Corbyn lead government would give the country a brexit it voted for? For example, their leaked manifesto says nothing about slowing or halting immigration? a subject close to your heart, yet you would advocate we should vote Labour?

I would no more vote to elect a Corbyn government than i would a May one and i dont get where you think i.m a Brexiteer i couldnt really care less whether we stay or go. Personally if it had been my decision I.d of started removing the immigrants and refugees and challenged the EU to stop me [ lets face it they did nothing when France set fire to the Calais camps did they ? ] while at the same time getting on board enough countries that if they expelled us and them it would fall apart overnight.

But people voting tactically in certain constituencies will not bring Corbyn to power but it may well stop May having that large majority that will be an utter disaster for anyone earning under 85k for the next five years and having said that there are polices i support from both of them [ having seen the Labour manifesto probably more in there than the Tory one but the most sensible thing comes from the Lib Dems but none of them have a policy of removing a net 100k foreigners each year so none of them get my endorsement ] so the only vote i would be casting would be a protest one and living in a Labour constituency with a great Labour constituency MP [ who hates Corbyn nearly as much as i do ] who will win with more than half of the vote but with who i disagree on a number of matters.

I.m not saying people should just vote Labour to stop the Torys i say vote for whoever has the best chance of stopping them in an individual constituency whether it be Labour, Liberal ,UKIP or Monster Raving Loony Party i dont care just vote for anyone but the bloody tory and say you did your bit to save our Schools and Hospitals from another 5 years of tory hell.

From an immigration point of view, there's only the Tories out of the big three that are stating they will limit, or attempt to limit, the numbers of people entering the uk to work/settle. The others are either too wet,wishy washy or too far extreme the other way. I believe we have to cut numbers, net immigration of 330k people a year cannot be sustained. Are we creating a million new jobs every three years? because that's what would be needed. Can the NHS cope with an increase in population of a million people every three years? Doubt it!
Labour's manifesto, leaked today, seems very predictable in that they would re-nationalise everything and tax the rich to save the poor. Abolish tuition fees! FFS they're the ones that allowed scottish labour mps to vote against them in Scotland but in favour of them in England! University/Higher education is not for everyone, it's been pushed that way at the expense of further education and apprenticeships in colleges. This system has been fecked over by govenments for the last 30years, it'll not be changed easily or cheaply. It'll be interesting to see how the analysts view their plans to pay for all this, I'm of the opinion they are bereft of new ideas and policies and are thus left with grand plans that would take many, many, years and massive amounts of money to acheive, and will more than likely never be achieved. They plan to increase tax for those earning 80k and over, what percentage of the population that pay tax are earning above 80k? I don't see that providing enough money to do what they suggest. It's no bad thing taking low earners out of tax but you also have to come up with a way of making up the shortfall you've just created, None of the parties will do this adequately because broad tax increases do not win votes. The short and small of it is, Labour are not capable of running the economy unless you want run into the ground.

Bruntonpasty wrote: From an immigration point of view, there's only the Tories out of the big three that are stating they will limit, or attempt to limit, the numbers of people entering the uk to work/settle. The others are either too wet,wishy washy or too far extreme the other way. I believe we have to cut numbers, net immigration of 330k people a year cannot be sustained. Are we creating a million new jobs every three years? because that's what would be needed. Can the NHS cope with an increase in population of a million people every three years? Doubt it!
Labour's manifesto, leaked today, seems very predictable in that they would re-nationalise everything and tax the rich to save the poor. Abolish tuition fees! FFS they're the ones that allowed scottish labour mps to vote against them in Scotland but in favour of them in England! University/Higher education is not for everyone, it's been pushed that way at the expense of further education and apprenticeships in colleges. This system has been fecked over by govenments for the last 30years, it'll not be changed easily or cheaply. It'll be interesting to see how the analysts view their plans to pay for all this, I'm of the opinion they are bereft of new ideas and policies and are thus left with grand plans that would take many, many, years and massive amounts of money to acheive, and will more than likely never be achieved. They plan to increase tax for those earning 80k and over, what percentage of the population that pay tax are earning above 80k? I don't see that providing enough money to do what they suggest. It's no bad thing taking low earners out of tax but you also have to come up with a way of making up the shortfall you've just created, None of the parties will do this adequately because broad tax increases do not win votes. The short and small of it is, Labour are not capable of running the economy unless you want run into the ground.

See whatever she might say i think Arron Banks had as much to do with May calling the early election as Brexit did as if hed had two years to get the new organisation off the ground they could well have taken as many as 50 seats at an election then and guess which party most of them would have been taken from.in constituencies where immigration and ghettoism is an issue.

But shes managed to well and truly spike him but he has bottomless pockets and i dont think hes going away anytime soon so we.ll just have to wait and see how that one works out.

University used to be for folk who needed a degree for their chosen career path - Dr's, Architect's, Engineers and the like.

It was then decided to make it more 'accessible' with more courses and student loans etc. Folk started seeing Uni as a 3/4yr do, on half baked courses, then left with average degrees and a pile of debt that many will never earn enough to come close to paying off.

That's when the Higher Education world became goosed!

The idea Aaron Banks and his new movement could take 50 seats in parliament is fantasyland. UKIP got 4 million votes and got 1. Never going to happen nor or was it ever likely to. For someone like Banks its not about seats in parliament its about influencing the debate.

May called an election as she knew that she would win by a landslide which a) makes it easier negotiating brexit b) removes legitimacy from the likes of the Liberals/SNP arguing for a soft brexit c) removes the - nobody voted for you attack line and d) gets her clear enough of us leaving in 2019 that she can run again without it being over shadowed by any brexit fallout.

Completely agree with CCU on university. Tony Blair and his crusade to send everyone to uni was a disaster. So many people doing nonsense degrees that will get them nowhere bar an average office job. We have ended up as a nation of unskilled people forced to therefore rely on immigration to fill the skills gap. We need to stop being PC about this and rather than saying 'choose what you want to do' start funnelling young people into what they are actually good at doing and giving them skills that will get them a job. Thats what its all about at the end of the day.

Blues86 wrote: The idea Aaron Banks and his new movement could take 50 seats in parliament is fantasyland. UKIP got 4 million votes and got 1. Never going to happen nor or was it ever likely to. For someone like Banks its not about seats in parliament its about influencing the debate.

May called an election as she knew that she would win by a landslide which a) makes it easier negotiating brexit b) removes legitimacy from the likes of the Liberals/SNP arguing for a soft brexit c) removes the - nobody voted for you attack line and d) gets her clear enough of us leaving in 2019 that she can run again without it being over shadowed by any brexit fallout.

Completely agree with CCU on university. Tony Blair and his crusade to send everyone to uni was a disaster. So many people doing nonsense degrees that will get them nowhere bar an average office job. We have ended up as a nation of unskilled people forced to therefore rely on immigration to fill the skills gap. We need to stop being PC about this and rather than saying 'choose what you want to do' start funnelling young people into what they are actually good at doing and giving them skills that will get them a job. Thats what its all about at the end of the day.

Yes they got 4 million votes over 650 constituencies concentrate that money and resources on just a 100 and those 4 million votes will easily get you 50 seats and believe me Banks wasnt looking to play it nicey nicey ask the former conservative MP for Brecon what happens when you cross him.

Aaron Banks doesn't have bottomless pockets, he isn't even worth as much as Fred Story.

DeckchairBlue wrote: Aaron Banks doesn't have bottomless pockets, he isn't even worth as much as Fred Story.

Aye if you read the Financial Times maybe. Didnt seem to wince when i put my invoice in last summer

CCU wrote: University used to be for folk who needed a degree for their chosen career path - Dr's, Architect's, Engineers and the like.

It was then decided to make it more 'accessible' with more courses and student loans etc. Folk started seeing Uni as a 3/4yr do, on half baked courses, then left with average degrees and a pile of debt that many will never earn enough to come close to paying off.

That's when the Higher Education world became goosed!

I agree some of the courses are silly, and some still are, however it is one of the very few things Brown got right.

The UK was/is falling behind our main competitive countries with standards in education at secondary and graduate level, something had to change.

The student loan system gave everyone the chance to go to University to gain further qualifications, life experiences and friends.

It will take time to get it right, but at least kinds now have a open door to further education at higher level, which should help raise secondary standards.

thesilentone wrote:

CCU wrote: University used to be for folk who needed a degree for their chosen career path - Dr's, Architect's, Engineers and the like.

It was then decided to make it more 'accessible' with more courses and student loans etc. Folk started seeing Uni as a 3/4yr do, on half baked courses, then left with average degrees and a pile of debt that many will never earn enough to come close to paying off.

That's when the Higher Education world became goosed!

I agree some of the courses are silly, and some still are, however it is one of the very few things Brown got right.

The UK was/is falling behind our main competitive countries with standards in education at secondary and graduate level, something had to change.

The student loan system gave everyone the chance to go to University to gain further qualifications, life experiences and friends.



It will take time to get it right, but at least kinds now have a open door to further education at higher level, which should help raise secondary standards.

You'd think wouldn't you....
Reality is that there were/are so many poor institutions giving out degrees that aren't worth the paper they're written on.
I know first hand that there are many, many students going through our Higher Education system that can't spell, punctuate nor write in a coherent academic manner.
I know one who was on my course in 1997 that couldn't spell at all, he was someone I'd expect to see in a remedial language class at Secondary School yet there he was fumbling through University on an honours degree. Mind Boggling, and he certainly wasn't alone.

Gordon and Tony made it accessible and filled my generation's heads full of deluded, grand ideas and minimum expectations, and they were 3 'A' Levels, a place on a degree course where upon graduation you'd immediately fall into an average £30,000 p.a job you sould expect as a graduate....like its a god given right to earn that because you've Ba or BSc after our name.
He could have sold snake oil just as well.

I kind of like the Tories idea of bringing back the Grammar School, if nothing else a return to that system would weed out those who are dedicated to academia from those who just think it would be fun to drink and shag for 3 years. If you're not mature enough at 15/16 to understand you need to work to get the better paid jobs like a Dr/Solicitor/Executive then you'd be better off having your sights trained on a more realistic career path for your level of commitment....those who can usually do in any case, just look at Sugar and Bannantyne!

Correct. You only need to look at jon vacancies 'educated to degree level' for an average office job. Unfortunately, these kids come out of uni and expect to walk into a well paid job, handed to them on a plate. They usually end up at middle manager level, with no real life experience, reinvent the wheel and piss off most of the staff on the way.

Very clever move to appeal to all the potheed voters, clever tactic to gain tactical votes.

Not even a free car for every voter if they get in would make the lib Dems credible.

They are in an enviable position of offering the voting public anything that they want because there is no chance of them getting into power.

munchymagic wrote: Not even a free car for every voter if they get in would make the lib Dems credible.

They are in an enviable position of offering the voting public anything that they want because there is no chance of them getting into power.

All very true there Munchy lad, but there will be the gullible out there who will give the Lib Dems their vote in the belief that, after the election, dope will be legal! Beware! there are feckwits at large!

To be honest, Labour have employed the same tactic to attract votes away from the Tories, offering abolition of tuition fees as an example.

FAO Mods. Feel free to move this to election thread if you like, I should have posted it there really, Sorry!

"The student loan system gave everyone the chance to go to University to gain further qualifications, life experiences and friends."

This bit did make me laugh, from the people I know it was just an excuse to not enter real life and toss it off for a few years - they happily admit this.

In the workplace I found most graduates far behind everyone else, like putting a four year old in with the seven year olds at school.

Our shortage of trades people is a legacy of the lack of forethought and investment in Further education i.e. Technical colleges, etc. Kids are pushed towards university when they really aren't of the correct academic mindset and a more practical vocational route would be more suitable. Schools have attracted funding to build facilities that have damaged further education colleges. For example, Ullswater community college has a hairdressing Salon and a motor vehicle repair workshop. Kids at 14 years old are being pushed up cul-de-sacs career wise when in reality they don't know their arses from their elbows(there will be odd exceptions). Schools should be concentrating on getting these kids a reasonably broad education but more importantly, up to standard in numeracy and literacy, Instead, when these kids arrive at colleges at 16, the colleges are having to spend time and funding patching them up, if the "young adult " will accept the help.

Bruntonpasty wrote:

munchymagic wrote: Not even a free car for every voter if they get in would make the lib Dems credible.

They are in an enviable position of offering the voting public anything that they want because there is no chance of them getting into power.

All very true there Munchy lad, but there will be the gullible out there who will give the Lib Dems their vote in the belief that, after the election, dope will be legal! Beware! there are feckwits at large!

To be honest, Labour have employed the same tactic to attract votes away from the Tories, offering abolition of tuition fees as an example.

FAO Mods. Feel free to move this to election thread if you like, I should have posted it there really, Sorry!

If you can't even post on the right thread how can we trust you to vote the right way on election day?