The Brexit Thread

I think so, but no one has owned up yet!

When the 1975 vote to join the EC happened, was that not a 'diving into the unknown'? Everybody saying 'nobody knows what will happen if we leave' - wasn't that very much the case 40 years ago too?

Pasty:
How do you think the EU Commissioners are appointed?
Ans, by the elected members of the European Parliament in terms of the President and then each elected member state gov appoints their own. Our own Civil Service is at the top appointed by the old boys public school network.
We have PR in European elections and there is no unelected House, like the House of Lords.
The whole out campaign has a flagrant and irresponsible disregard for facts and it seems to me that half of the people are developing some kind of jingoistic hysteria (whipped up by self serving Boris and Nige) and frankly just can't be arsed to find out or even consider inconvenient truths and would rather wrap themselves in a Union Jack and float off on HMS Boris and hope for the best.
And of course Cameron is right about pensions and the NHS. If your economy goes down the pan then so will your public service.
And Brown was right today over workers rights.
Farage, his "so what" response to the £ falling is ridiculous. A major fall would increase inflation as we import so much and then interest rates would have to rise putting up borrowing costs for all.

Deano, to some extent that would have been true but we are where we are now and are so integrated that the divorce will be almost impossible and certainly will be very messy and take many, many years.
Even then if we want to remain in the single market we will have to accept Free Movement of people and EU legislation like Norway, over which we will have NO say at all. It will hugely embarrassing for Nige and Boris but eventually they will have to agree.
Meantime the uncertainty will hit currency, markets and therefore pensions, the Pound will fall putting up inflation and interest rates will rise. The economy will contract and jobs will be lost.
The risks of leaving are huge. Staying may not be perfect but Leaving has so much risk that in all honesty I'm staggered that most folk are just ignoring. It's time to get fingers out of ears.

Because some folk are voting leave as a [censored] you to the establishment.

Cameron,Osborne,Blair,Brown,Major,Corbyn have been wheeled out for remain. More a collection of spunktrumpets, l've yet to see. All are toxic in people's eyes. People just do not believe them. Seeing as you can't predict the future,all these apocolyptic scare stories just carry no weight with the ordinary man in the street.

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Deckchair, Im disappointed in you, normally your points are better made than that! the last sentence could be just as easily applied to the remain campaign wih a couple of words changed.

Out

Cumbria

OUT

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Perhaps you can point me to whoever said the Milk and Honey statement as i must of missed that one.

But apart from that youre spot on.

The leave campaign dont really need to do anything at all Cameron and co are saying is vote stay and everything will stay the same Well i.m sorry but most people have had enough and dont want things to stay the same.

We want to be in control of our own destiny decide who can come in and who cant decide who we want to trade with and who we dont and most importantly decide for ourselves whether or not we want to buy bent bananas and cucumbers.

Its called freedom to choose so if Merkel wants to fill her country with Islamic State Muslims well lets leave her to get on with it as it.ll not be long before proper Germans are all wanting to come here to get away from it.

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Perhaps you can point me to whoever said the Milk and Honey statement as i must of missed that one.

But apart from that youre spot on.

The leave campaign dont really need to do anything at all Cameron and co are saying is vote stay and everything will stay the same Well i.m sorry but most people have had enough and dont want things to stay the same.

We want to be in control of our own destiny decide who can come in and who cant decide who we want to trade with and who we dont and most importantly decide for ourselves whether or not we want to buy bent bananas and cucumbers.

Its called freedom to choose so if Merkel wants to fill her country with Islamic State Muslims well lets leave her to get on with it as it.ll not be long before proper Germans are all wanting to come here to get away from it.

The bookies dont seem to think that although it is getting closer.

Blaming immigrants of another religion,has worked so well for Germany,previously.

High Street wrote: Blaming immigrants of another religion,has worked so well for Germany,previously.

Donald Trump is using the same strategy. So far it seems to be working for him. That's what we're up against.

Well religion is a dangerous thing....it causes more bad than good in the world

It more than likely will end this planet

is it any wonder people are scared of it???

Out

Dancingbear wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Perhaps you can point me to whoever said the Milk and Honey statement as i must of missed that one.

But apart from that youre spot on.

The leave campaign dont really need to do anything at all Cameron and co are saying is vote stay and everything will stay the same Well i.m sorry but most people have had enough and dont want things to stay the same.

We want to be in control of our own destiny decide who can come in and who cant decide who we want to trade with and who we dont and most importantly decide for ourselves whether or not we want to buy bent bananas and cucumbers.

Its called freedom to choose so if Merkel wants to fill her country with Islamic State Muslims well lets leave her to get on with it as it.ll not be long before proper Germans are all wanting to come here to get away from it.

The bookies dont seem to think that although it is getting closer.

Does anybody really believe or care what the fu*ck the bookies think.

They know so little they think Blackpool are a better bet for the division 2 title than we are which is quite strange coz i dont know any Blackpool fans who think that.

The most telling aspect is that everyone knows dozens of people who are saying i might vote to stay in but i could be persuaded

How many people do you know who are saying i.m voting to leave but i.m open to have my mind changed.

What that means is that the OUT vote is solid and the REMAIN vote is shall we say fluffy.and open to persuasion and the longer it goes on the bigger knobs and liars Cameron and Osbourne are making themselves look.

In my opinion whats stopping a lot of them coming over is a the majority of the so called experts saying staying would be good but i.ve yet to see any of them back it up with absolute facts but they wont because they cant. And thats before you take into account theyre all people with somthing to lose if we vote to come out.

What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

Did you tell them what you called the Blackburn owners?

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Dancingbear wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Perhaps you can point me to whoever said the Milk and Honey statement as i must of missed that one.

But apart from that youre spot on.

The leave campaign dont really need to do anything at all Cameron and co are saying is vote stay and everything will stay the same Well i.m sorry but most people have had enough and dont want things to stay the same.

We want to be in control of our own destiny decide who can come in and who cant decide who we want to trade with and who we dont and most importantly decide for ourselves whether or not we want to buy bent bananas and cucumbers.

Its called freedom to choose so if Merkel wants to fill her country with Islamic State Muslims well lets leave her to get on with it as it.ll not be long before proper Germans are all wanting to come here to get away from it.

The bookies dont seem to think that although it is getting closer.

Does anybody really believe or care what the fu*ck the bookies think.

They know so little they think Blackpool are a better bet for the division 2 title than we are which is quite strange coz i dont know any Blackpool fans who think that.

The most telling aspect is that everyone knows dozens of people who are saying i might vote to stay in but i could be persuaded

How many people do you know who are saying i.m voting to leave but i.m open to have my mind changed.

What that means is that the OUT vote is solid and the REMAIN vote is shall we say fluffy.and open to persuasion and the longer it goes on the bigger knobs and liars Cameron and Osbourne are making themselves look.

In my opinion whats stopping a lot of them coming over is a the majority of the so called experts saying staying would be good but i.ve yet to see any of them back it up with absolute facts but they wont because they cant. And thats before you take into account theyre all people with somthing to lose if we vote to come out.

I might be wrong but i thought they didnt like giving money away. Therefore if they thought the majority were gonna vote leave theyd have that favourite wouldnt they?

BTW Carlisle and Blackpool are both best priced 25/1

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

So you see Brexit as the first step to cleanse Britain of nasty foreigners NS?

To regular readers this is no great surprise although you seem a little confused as to where you are going to draw the line.

It seems Asians will be OK if they're Monarchists, but Syrians and East Europeans will have to go?

Can you please clarify?

Bruntonpasty wrote:

DeckchairBlue wrote:

pacirv wrote: Seems to me the out campaigners are ignoring all the remain in arguments regardless of the validity of a lot of the experts non govt or not, to risk diving into the unknown purely on largely emotive issues about control. I'm still not convinced either way about arguments on both sides, personally I'm far from happy having decisions on what happens in Cumbria made in London by a govt who are in power through a flawed and outdated voting system.

Absolutely agree, the out campaign and supporters seem to have taken a moral high ground and a view that their way is the best way regardless and that there can be no possible positives of staying in, but leaving will be a land of milk and honey.

Deckchair, Im disappointed in you, normally your points are better made than that! the last sentence could be just as easily applied to the remain campaign wih a couple of words changed.

Apologies, can I chalk it down to lack of sleep after a weekend of night shifts ?

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

You realise post Brexit (if it happens) eu citizens currently in the country will be able to remain don't you ?

We will also more than likely still let all of those nasty foreigners in when we realise there's nobody to pick our spuds.

I was doing some research and read a paper that is basically saying we get vale for money from EU membership.

ukandeu.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/01...fessor-Iain-Begg.pdf

The net cost (2014) is said to be £9.8 billion or £188 million. However, the data is not transparent and it could be significantly higher at £13.4 billion - £14.7 billion (£258 million - £283 million per week). The author justifies this by saying the amount per person is just £4.40 per week or the price of a season ticket to watch Cambridge United. He implicitly concludes it is not a lot.

How many of us CUFC (the proper one) supporters have questioned if we have the £ to pay for a season ticket. I suspect many - - and we have the choice. Now how many of us belong to a household of 5 with a net total annual income of £25,000 (this probably very high for Cumbria). That £22 per week contribution to the EU budget works out over £1,000 per year or 4 % of total income. This after about 7 years when real incomes (taking into account inflation) have fallen and 6 years of Osbourne screwing the most vulnerable in society.

Yet taking that £9.8 billion noted in the first sentence, the comparable figure for 2009 was £4.3 billion. Thats to say that in the 7 years of the need for austerity being driven in by the tories, the cost of membership to the UK of being a member of the EU has more than doubled. What austerity?

The report cited also claims that other countries pay more (i.e Germany and France in total terms) while Italy pays about the same (see www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eure...o-the-EU-budget.html ) . That is their choice. But in 2013 - ten countries got more out of the EU than the UK i.e the UK is subsidising other countries.

Amongst the countries we are subsiding are Poland and Romania. Of course, many recent migrants to the come from those two countries. In effect, due to migration, te contribution per capita reduces for these 2 countries while the UK is one of the countries prejudiced in financial terms. I would also claim that the UK supports a large number of inefficient French farmers who benefit from the CAP. Our fishermen continue to suffer from a wholly inadequate CFP, with the Spanish laughing all the way back to Galicia.

The high net migration to the UK stretches the already stretched public services - health, school, transport. Hence the value-for-money to the UK tax payer reduces. Personally, I have no issues with immigration and I would be one of the last to be considered racialist or xenophobe but it is beyond logic to continue to let 10,000s enter the UK each year without planning and without the new investment needed to maintain the level of services everyone in the UK (and not just the british British but everyone who has settled there in the pat 50 years) has the right to expect.

For those reasons, it is OUT. And that is without having to even consider all the bullying and fear tactics employed by cameron and his cronies.

Out. I still havent heard a genuine reason to remain
never let a drowning man grab hold of you because they will take you down with them. I think the EU project is floundering and ruining each developed country in it. It already is on borrowed time and money. Donald Tusk has admitted that the EU's ethos of greater integration is not shared by the people.
If we remain it is a green light for all the dubious rules that they have sat on until after the vote.
Put simply the only way we could bring control to immigration is by leaving. If we remain, it doesn't matter if our economy is better (which isn't guaranteed) any benefits from that would be negated by the influx of more people. Leave, take the hit, take control of immigration and bounce back.

I respect those opinions who wish to remain even if I don't understand why. This board has shown the most remainiacs represented. Most polls and forums I've seen are about 80% for leave.

business.facebook.com/notes/what-happens...5?platform=hootsuite

. Research conducted by Professor Patrick Minford of the Cardiff Business School shows that departure from the EU could see living standards in Britain rise by at least 8 per cent. Another study by eight leading economists says that The UK’s economy could rise by 4 per cent.
2. Capital Economics, in a paper on behalf of Woodford Investment Management, say: ‘There are potential net benefits in the areas of a more tailored immigration policy, the freedom to make trade deals, moderately lower levels of regulation and savings to the public purse. In each of these areas, we do not believe that the benefits of Brexit would be huge, but they are likely to be positive.’ This stands in extreme contrast to the irresponsible doom-mongering offered by Government organisations.
3. We will save a significant portion of a gross payment of £350 million per week that we make to the EU. Estimates by Open Europe (a pro-EU think tank) say that EU regulation costs up to £33 billion per year. While the UK may wish to keep some of the regulations which make up that cost we will have control over our own rules – not distant and unaccountable bureaucrats in Brussels.
4. We will be able to negotiate trade deals with other countries. This way we can trade freely rather than waiting for the EU to negotiate trade agreements with the rest of the world.
5. The Eurozone’s trade surplus with the UK accounts for 37% of the Eurozone’s worldwide trade surplus. This will make it difficult for the EU to impose tariff and non-tariff barriers on the UK because they will continue to want to sell VWs and Audis to us.

Shouldn't we be picking our own spuds with 1.6 million unemployed?

Belle vue nice to see someone is looking past the nationalistic jingo and using their brain. I'd be the first to admit if I went with my heart I would vote out but if you take a real look at everything and especially taking away the fact that the EU to some extent stop this Govt of ours pushing through their extremes then far better to stay in and fight from within. Cameron is already showing his intentions with his threats. Talk of controlling our own decisions is a fallacy the Tories plan on over ruling decisions by local councils on the likes of fracking and nuclear regardless, is that what is called democracy.

The whole issue is actually starting to reek of the Scottish independence vote where the out campaigners were getting very aggressive and threatening. It's OK to have an opinion as long as it agrees with them.
Would be interesting to know what ALs opinion is in all this.

Latest polls show Britain is due to leave
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/e...-david-a7075131.html

pacirv wrote: IN
finally made my mind up the thought of ending up with the lunatic Boris running an already obscene Govt is enough for me.

You are much more likely to get a Boris running the government if you vote in.... if remain win there is very likely to be a vote of no confidence in Cameron within the Conservative party and Boris would be the most likely replacement. This could happen a matter of weeks after the referendum.

Without an equal financial and economic policy the EU and EURO is not sustainable. With the massive difference in each Countries earnings and living standards and the huge difference in expectations the EU will only ever be a political superstate to compete with Russia, China and the USA.

The EU is a state of excess, over pricing and regulation that cannot compete in the World market and is the only ' Superstate ' that is declining. In the past we have dumped the excess on Russia, under Putin this is no longer happening so some commodity markets have fallen badly.

I detest the idea of some unelected spurious career politician from a country the size of Cumbria making decisions that will affect my daily life.

EU Trade Union - Yes
Political Union - NO, NO, NO !!!

cyberslob wrote: Out. I still havent heard a genuine reason to remain
never let a drowning man grab hold of you because they will take you down with them. I think the EU project is floundering and ruining each developed country in it. It already is on borrowed time and money. Donald Tusk has admitted that the EU's ethos of greater integration is not shared by the people.
If we remain it is a green light for all the dubious rules that they have sat on until after the vote.
Put simply the only way we could bring control to immigration is by leaving. If we remain, it doesn't matter if our economy is better (which isn't guaranteed) any benefits from that would be negated by the influx of more people. Leave, take the hit, take control of immigration and bounce back.

I respect those opinions who wish to remain even if I don't understand why. This board has shown the most remainiacs represented. Most polls and forums I've seen are about 80% for leave.

The biggest reason to remain is that we will have to negotiate our own trade agreements. When the EU wanted to toughen its stance on China with tariffs Cameron blocked it. Increased information of off shore companies, Cameron blocked it. Building nuclear weapons, nuclear power stations and fast train lines- all hugely over budget and going out of the UK. All of the evidence shows that Cameron couldn't negotiate a sharp turn in a Tesco aisle. While the EU may not always act perfectly in our interests because of its size and the checks and balances in place recent evidence shows it can do it much better than the current Government.

Depending on which report you read the financial services sector in London represents 20-40% of the UK economy. Germany has worked furiously to boost Frankfurt (even though it still has less money than Edinburgh under management). If we leave the EU will tax financial transactions particularly euro transactions, euro bond issues will all go through Frankfurt etc so the loss to London could be significant.

All of the posts here look at the British reaction but none of them consider the reaction of the EU. Cameron spent a lot of time and money with his nose up Saudi arses and he signed an agreement to sell them £671m worth of arms for use in Yemen. To slap him on the wrist for allowing this EU farce the EU banned exports of weapons to Saudi, but they waited for him to sign the greement first. If the EU bans British cheese? Cars? God knows what. They will react, they won't just passively sit by. If Britain leaves, the EU needs that action to be a failure and they have the means to ensure it will be

Markovitch wrote:

cyberslob wrote: Out. I still havent heard a genuine reason to remain
never let a drowning man grab hold of you because they will take you down with them. I think the EU project is floundering and ruining each developed country in it. It already is on borrowed time and money. Donald Tusk has admitted that the EU's ethos of greater integration is not shared by the people.
If we remain it is a green light for all the dubious rules that they have sat on until after the vote.
Put simply the only way we could bring control to immigration is by leaving. If we remain, it doesn't matter if our economy is better (which isn't guaranteed) any benefits from that would be negated by the influx of more people. Leave, take the hit, take control of immigration and bounce back.

I respect those opinions who wish to remain even if I don't understand why. This board has shown the most remainiacs represented. Most polls and forums I've seen are about 80% for leave.

The biggest reason to remain is that we will have to negotiate our own trade agreements. When the EU wanted to toughen its stance on China with tariffs Cameron blocked it. Increased information of off shore companies, Cameron blocked it. Building nuclear weapons, nuclear power stations and fast train lines- all hugely over budget and going out of the UK. All of the evidence shows that Cameron couldn't negotiate a sharp turn in a Tesco aisle. While the EU may not always act perfectly in our interests because of its size and the checks and balances in place recent evidence shows it can do it much better than the current Government.

Depending on which report you read the financial services sector in London represents 20-40% of the UK economy. Germany has worked furiously to boost Frankfurt (even though it still has less money than Edinburgh under management). If we leave the EU will tax financial transactions particularly euro transactions, euro bond issues will all go through Frankfurt etc so the loss to London could be significant.

All of the posts here look at the British reaction but none of them consider the reaction of the EU. Cameron spent a lot of time and money with his nose up Saudi arses and he signed an agreement to sell them £671m worth of arms for use in Yemen. To slap him on the wrist for allowing this EU farce the EU banned exports of weapons to Saudi, but they waited for him to sign the greement first. If the EU bans British cheese? Cars? God knows what. They will react, they won't just passively sit by. If Britain leaves, the EU needs that action to be a failure and they have the means to ensure it will be

I shouldn't worry, if we vote to leave that will be the end of Cameron.

Our Exit will see others do the same, this will the be catalyst for a new European Trade Union that will include the UK, however with rules that also consider devolution.

BlueAl wrote: Shouldn't we be picking our own spuds with 1.6 million unemployed?

We should he your right. However for some reason many of our young, unskilled unemployed believe that manual labour is beneath them. It's not like it's low paid either.

thesilentone wrote:

Markovitch wrote:

cyberslob wrote: Out. I still havent heard a genuine reason to remain
never let a drowning man grab hold of you because they will take you down with them. I think the EU project is floundering and ruining each developed country in it. It already is on borrowed time and money. Donald Tusk has admitted that the EU's ethos of greater integration is not shared by the people.
If we remain it is a green light for all the dubious rules that they have sat on until after the vote.
Put simply the only way we could bring control to immigration is by leaving. If we remain, it doesn't matter if our economy is better (which isn't guaranteed) any benefits from that would be negated by the influx of more people. Leave, take the hit, take control of immigration and bounce back.

I respect those opinions who wish to remain even if I don't understand why. This board has shown the most remainiacs represented. Most polls and forums I've seen are about 80% for leave.

The biggest reason to remain is that we will have to negotiate our own trade agreements. When the EU wanted to toughen its stance on China with tariffs Cameron blocked it. Increased information of off shore companies, Cameron blocked it. Building nuclear weapons, nuclear power stations and fast train lines- all hugely over budget and going out of the UK. All of the evidence shows that Cameron couldn't negotiate a sharp turn in a Tesco aisle. While the EU may not always act perfectly in our interests because of its size and the checks and balances in place recent evidence shows it can do it much better than the current Government.

Depending on which report you read the financial services sector in London represents 20-40% of the UK economy. Germany has worked furiously to boost Frankfurt (even though it still has less money than Edinburgh under management). If we leave the EU will tax financial transactions particularly euro transactions, euro bond issues will all go through Frankfurt etc so the loss to London could be significant.

All of the posts here look at the British reaction but none of them consider the reaction of the EU. Cameron spent a lot of time and money with his nose up Saudi arses and he signed an agreement to sell them £671m worth of arms for use in Yemen. To slap him on the wrist for allowing this EU farce the EU banned exports of weapons to Saudi, but they waited for him to sign the greement first. If the EU bans British cheese? Cars? God knows what. They will react, they won't just passively sit by. If Britain leaves, the EU needs that action to be a failure and they have the means to ensure it will be

I shouldn't worry, if we vote to leave that will be the end of Cameron.

Our Exit will see others do the same, this will the be catalyst for a new European Trade Union that will include the UK, however with rules that also consider devolution.

How long do you think it takes to agree trade deals ? They can very easily become long drawn out things meaning, taking than the 2 years we have to leave after the vote.

The leave campaign also seems to assume that we could agree a deal with the EU to reap all of the benefits of membership without any cost, basically having similar terms to what we have now. There is no guarantee of this.

Nor is there any guarantee that any trade deals we agree with non-EU nations would have similar terms to what we have currently as we would be negotiating as a nation of 65m rather than a block of 500m.

When will people learn .The main point should be the country not Economy or imigration.As i have said in previous threads Why should we be told how to act or what to do by people we have not elected.The brave men who fought 2 world wars to stop us being ruled by or told what to do by others .Since we joined the EU we have slowly sold these men down the river to the EU so its our fault for voting to join.And for president Obama to come over to tell us to stay in after they lost all them men in the war .How would he like it if someone in Venuzuela was telling how to act or what to do i for one would think the Americans would be up in arms .Do the military not swear when they join up for Queen and country or something along those lines infact i think the Queen should get involved and stand up and tell everyone to get there country back .

Tom wrote: Did you tell them what you called the Blackburn owners?

Shit no i forgot to put that in

I bet if i.d slagged them off i.d of got a couple more minutes applause

howoldboy wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

So you see Brexit as the first step to cleanse Britain of nasty foreigners NS?

To regular readers this is no great surprise although you seem a little confused as to where you are going to draw the line.

It seems Asians will be OK if they're Monarchists, but Syrians and East Europeans will have to go?

Can you please clarify?

Not a case of cleansing anyone

If we leave the EU anyone who came here as a result of us of us being in the EU will no longer have a legitimate right to stay.

So any Syrians etc that are here as a result of Merkels policies will be required to leave [ I.m sure Angela will welcome them with open arms ] but the 20k that dodgy Dave agreed to take direct from the countries surrounding Syria are fine on the 5 year licences if Syria is sorted by then they will be assisted to return home.

As far as the East Europeans are concerned they lose any right to be here so we just make their lives difficult encouraging them to go home [ like banning foreign based recruitment agencies and deporting anyone whos been here less than 10 years on conviction of any criminal offence.] Estimate is we could lose up to 2m over 10 years.

Good old Donalds plan for a blacklist of countries from who we wont let anyone in is worth a look at and the overall plan would be to admit no more each year than the number of Brits who left the year before.

Massive benefits all round thousands of school places become available without spending a penny, much less pressure on the Health service, thousands of council/housing association homes become available saving the country hundreds of millions a year.

Yes there will be a loss of tax take but a lot less than a lot of people think because dont forget were starting at the bottom with the least desirable/least tax paying and its very unlikely it would reach anyone on higher rate tax band for instance unless of course they wanted to leave because for example their businesses markets had disappeared back to Poland.

BlueAl wrote: Shouldn't we be picking our own spuds with 1.6 million unemployed?

Yes we should and we should be paying them £10 an hour to do it maybe some of it in the form of tax credits or similar paid for by the reduction in people claiming out of work benefits.

It really isnt rocket science but when you make kids stay at school till theyre 18 when they dont want to they arent going to want to pick potatoes once theyve got qualifications so accept there are kids with less academic abilities and let them get on with their lives earning 400 quid a week picking potatoes and thereby young couples with an income of over 3k a month would be able to afford a mortgage even as a potato picker.

DeckchairBlue wrote:

thesilentone wrote:

Markovitch wrote:

cyberslob wrote: Out. I still havent heard a genuine reason to remain
never let a drowning man grab hold of you because they will take you down with them. I think the EU project is floundering and ruining each developed country in it. It already is on borrowed time and money. Donald Tusk has admitted that the EU's ethos of greater integration is not shared by the people.
If we remain it is a green light for all the dubious rules that they have sat on until after the vote.
Put simply the only way we could bring control to immigration is by leaving. If we remain, it doesn't matter if our economy is better (which isn't guaranteed) any benefits from that would be negated by the influx of more people. Leave, take the hit, take control of immigration and bounce back.

I respect those opinions who wish to remain even if I don't understand why. This board has shown the most remainiacs represented. Most polls and forums I've seen are about 80% for leave.

The biggest reason to remain is that we will have to negotiate our own trade agreements. When the EU wanted to toughen its stance on China with tariffs Cameron blocked it. Increased information of off shore companies, Cameron blocked it. Building nuclear weapons, nuclear power stations and fast train lines- all hugely over budget and going out of the UK. All of the evidence shows that Cameron couldn't negotiate a sharp turn in a Tesco aisle. While the EU may not always act perfectly in our interests because of its size and the checks and balances in place recent evidence shows it can do it much better than the current Government.

Depending on which report you read the financial services sector in London represents 20-40% of the UK economy. Germany has worked furiously to boost Frankfurt (even though it still has less money than Edinburgh under management). If we leave the EU will tax financial transactions particularly euro transactions, euro bond issues will all go through Frankfurt etc so the loss to London could be significant.

All of the posts here look at the British reaction but none of them consider the reaction of the EU. Cameron spent a lot of time and money with his nose up Saudi arses and he signed an agreement to sell them £671m worth of arms for use in Yemen. To slap him on the wrist for allowing this EU farce the EU banned exports of weapons to Saudi, but they waited for him to sign the greement first. If the EU bans British cheese? Cars? God knows what. They will react, they won't just passively sit by. If Britain leaves, the EU needs that action to be a failure and they have the means to ensure it will be

I shouldn't worry, if we vote to leave that will be the end of Cameron.

Our Exit will see others do the same, this will the be catalyst for a new European Trade Union that will include the UK, however with rules that also consider devolution.

How long do you think it takes to agree trade deals ? They can very easily become long drawn out things meaning, taking than the 2 years we have to leave after the vote.

The leave campaign also seems to assume that we could agree a deal with the EU to reap all of the benefits of membership without any cost, basically having similar terms to what we have now. There is no guarantee of this.

Nor is there any guarantee that any trade deals we agree with non-EU nations would have similar terms to what we have currently as we would be negotiating as a nation of 65m rather than a block of 500m.

You should have watched Digby Jones on TV at Lunchtime he completely busted open the tariffs myth and explained how and why they simply wont happen and how us not charging other countries tariffs could well result in our trade increasing not decreasing.

And how whatever mad scheme the EU introduce the German motor industry will simply bust it wide open by ignoring it and every other manufacturing sector who want to export to us will soon follow.

To many people are voting with their heart and not their head and only on the immigration issue, while the likes of TTIP is been mooted that could result in major companies suing and bankrupting countries. If we vote out we will be at the mercy of an uncaring Govt with no one to curb their extreme policies.

pacirv wrote: To many people are voting with their heart and not their head and only on the immigration issue, while the likes of TTIP is been mooted that could result in major companies suing and bankrupting countries. If we vote out we will be at the mercy of an uncaring Govt with no one to curb their extreme policies.

But thats the whole point we wont because the way the main parties are pulling themselves apart the chances of coalition govmt are increasing massively and that can only lead to the smaller parties achieving a form of proportional representation and if you take it that the two main parties are each split in two the votes [ if not necessarily at present the seats ] will be spread between up to 7 factions/parties and it will only take one real coalition government and we.ll have some form of PR for ever and the days of things like Camerons austerity packages will be consigned to history for ever.starting with guaranteed funding for local councils to provide a much wider range of compulsory services that are important to the local communities like Librarys and Transport subsidies.

To the title thread, At the last General Election the Sun backed Cameron and his Cohorts up to the hilt. Now they say he as used every dirty an cynical trick in the book to secure a stay vote. Well this man could crawl under a snakes belly with a stove plpe hat on, He as no bounds to lying and trying to con the plebs to vote stay. And Corbyn the Clown is no better, do you honestly believe all Labour Councillors want to stay, At least some of the Tories have got the balls to say what they believe but not that shower of shit. Well I don't need Corbyn Dodgy Dave Brown Bliar or any other cheesedick to tell me how to vote, ITS OUT FOR ME.....

pensionerblue wrote: To the title thread, At the last General Election the Sun backed Cameron and his Cohorts up to the hilt. Now they say he as used every dirty an cynical trick in the book to secure a stay vote. Well this man could crawl under a snakes belly with a stove plpe hat on, He as no bounds to lying and trying to con the plebs to vote stay. And Corbyn the Clown is no better, do you honestly believe all Labour Councillors want to stay, At least some of the Tories have got the balls to say what they believe but not that shower of shit. Well I don't need Corbyn Dodgy Dave Brown Bliar or any other cheesedick to tell me how to vote, ITS OUT FOR ME.....

Add Sturgeon to the list and they are all acting like Euro Politicians. Don't know what she is going to do if the Jocks vote Brexit, it will be like the General Election - resignations in alphabetical order please !!

Vote OUT...

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

howoldboy wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

So you see Brexit as the first step to cleanse Britain of nasty foreigners NS?

To regular readers this is no great surprise although you seem a little confused as to where you are going to draw the line.

It seems Asians will be OK if they're Monarchists, but Syrians and East Europeans will have to go?

Can you please clarify?

Not a case of cleansing anyone

If we leave the EU anyone who came here as a result of us of us being in the EU will no longer have a legitimate right to stay.

So any Syrians etc that are here as a result of Merkels policies will be required to leave [ I.m sure Angela will welcome them with open arms ] but the 20k that dodgy Dave agreed to take direct from the countries surrounding Syria are fine on the 5 year licences if Syria is sorted by then they will be assisted to return home.

As far as the East Europeans are concerned they lose any right to be here so we just make their lives difficult encouraging them to go home [ like banning foreign based recruitment agencies and deporting anyone whos been here less than 10 years on conviction of any criminal offence.] Estimate is we could lose up to 2m over 10 years.

Good old Donalds plan for a blacklist of countries from who we wont let anyone in is worth a look at and the overall plan would be to admit no more each year than the number of Brits who left the year before.

Massive benefits all round thousands of school places become available without spending a penny, much less pressure on the Health service, thousands of council/housing association homes become available saving the country hundreds of millions a year.

Yes there will be a loss of tax take but a lot less than a lot of people think because dont forget were starting at the bottom with the least desirable/least tax paying and its very unlikely it would reach anyone on higher rate tax band for instance unless of course they wanted to leave because for example their businesses markets had disappeared back to Poland.

Your ethnic cleansing ideas fail to acknowledge that the Leave campaign have already said that anybody already in the country when we come out of the EU will have indefinite leave to remain. Nobody will be kicked out.

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

BlueAl wrote: Shouldn't we be picking our own spuds with 1.6 million unemployed?

Yes we should and we should be paying them £10 an hour to do it maybe some of it in the form of tax credits or similar paid for by the reduction in people claiming out of work benefits.

It really isnt rocket science but when you make kids stay at school till theyre 18 when they dont want to they arent going to want to pick potatoes once theyve got qualifications so accept there are kids with less academic abilities and let them get on with their lives earning 400 quid a week picking potatoes and thereby young couples with an income of over 3k a month would be able to afford a mortgage even as a potato picker.

I've not picked potatoes but as a student I did one day picking courgettes on piece work and have to say it was the most back-breaking soul-destroying job imaginable. If Eastern Europeans are willing to do vegetable picking for the minimum wage then let them get on with it.

DeckchairBlue wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

howoldboy wrote:

NORTHERNSOUL wrote:

Useless wrote: What's stopping me voting leave is the prospect of sharing a similar stance as you on anything at all.

Well when we vote leave on the 23rd according to some on here we.ll all become racists wether we like it or not so you wont really have a lot of choice.

I made a speech at a Patrons lunch yesterday and received a standing ovation not bad for a crowd who were about a quarter Asian.they love the idea of sending the Syrians and East Europeans home..

So you see Brexit as the first step to cleanse Britain of nasty foreigners NS?

To regular readers this is no great surprise although you seem a little confused as to where you are going to draw the line.

It seems Asians will be OK if they're Monarchists, but Syrians and East Europeans will have to go?

Can you please clarify?

Not a case of cleansing anyone

If we leave the EU anyone who came here as a result of us of us being in the EU will no longer have a legitimate right to stay.

So any Syrians etc that are here as a result of Merkels policies will be required to leave [ I.m sure Angela will welcome them with open arms ] but the 20k that dodgy Dave agreed to take direct from the countries surrounding Syria are fine on the 5 year licences if Syria is sorted by then they will be assisted to return home.

As far as the East Europeans are concerned they lose any right to be here so we just make their lives difficult encouraging them to go home [ like banning foreign based recruitment agencies and deporting anyone whos been here less than 10 years on conviction of any criminal offence.] Estimate is we could lose up to 2m over 10 years.

Good old Donalds plan for a blacklist of countries from who we wont let anyone in is worth a look at and the overall plan would be to admit no more each year than the number of Brits who left the year before.

Massive benefits all round thousands of school places become available without spending a penny, much less pressure on the Health service, thousands of council/housing association homes become available saving the country hundreds of millions a year.

Yes there will be a loss of tax take but a lot less than a lot of people think because dont forget were starting at the bottom with the least desirable/least tax paying and its very unlikely it would reach anyone on higher rate tax band for instance unless of course they wanted to leave because for example their businesses markets had disappeared back to Poland.

Your ethnic cleansing ideas fail to acknowledge that the Leave campaign have already said that anybody already in the country when we come out of the EU will have indefinite leave to remain. Nobody will be kicked out.

The Leave campaign said that to increase their chances of winning the Brexit vote. Once they get power the ethnic cleansing will begin. Personally I would start with any ex-Cumbrians supporting Accrington.

In the case of a general election most folk who vote tend to vote for the party they dislike the least, the beauty of this referendum is you can vote for what you believe. The leave campaign appears to be gaining ground perhaps because people are warming to the idea of being able to shove it to Dave and Jeremy and Nicola and Tim and all those that generally shove to the great British public most of the time.
The remain campaign have recently wheeled out that giant of a statesman - Gordon Brown, the same GB that sold of the gold reserves of the country for a tad less than they were worth and then raided the pension pots of hard working people, then the remain campaign have the cheek to say pensioners will be worse off should we vote to leave the EU, thanks to that berk, I don`t think so.
Anyway it seems the nearer we get to polling day, the high pitched whine that forms the basis of the remain campaign gets louder and goes up an octave, keep it up, you`re doing great for the leave campaign.

Yorkie Blue wrote: In the case of a general election most folk who vote tend to vote for the party they dislike the least, the beauty of this referendum is you can vote for what you believe. The leave campaign appears to be gaining ground perhaps because people are warming to the idea of being able to shove it to Dave and Jeremy and Nicola and Tim and all those that generally shove to the great British public most of the time.
The remain campaign have recently wheeled out that giant of a statesman - Gordon Brown, the same GB that sold of the gold reserves of the country for a tad less than they were worth and then raided the pension pots of hard working people, then the remain campaign have the cheek to say pensioners will be worse off should we vote to leave the EU, thanks to that berk, I don`t think so.
Anyway it seems the nearer we get to polling day, the high pitched whine that forms the basis of the remain campaign gets louder and goes up an octave, keep it up, you`re doing great for the leave campaign.

They're saving their secret weapon until next Wednesday. Chicken Licken has been booked to tell us the sky is gonna fall in if we vote leave.

Dancingbear wrote:

Yorkie Blue wrote: In the case of a general election most folk who vote tend to vote for the party they dislike the least, the beauty of this referendum is you can vote for what you believe. The leave campaign appears to be gaining ground perhaps because people are warming to the idea of being able to shove it to Dave and Jeremy and Nicola and Tim and all those that generally shove to the great British public most of the time.
The remain campaign have recently wheeled out that giant of a statesman - Gordon Brown, the same GB that sold of the gold reserves of the country for a tad less than they were worth and then raided the pension pots of hard working people, then the remain campaign have the cheek to say pensioners will be worse off should we vote to leave the EU, thanks to that berk, I don`t think so.
Anyway it seems the nearer we get to polling day, the high pitched whine that forms the basis of the remain campaign gets louder and goes up an octave, keep it up, you`re doing great for the leave campaign.

They're saving their secret weapon until next Wednesday. Chicken Licken has been booked to tell us the sky is gonna fall in if we vote leave.

Do you know if henny penny or cocky locky are set to make an appearance?